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Ahmad
03-20-2005, 05:55 AM
Peace be upon you,


The feminist movements that started with a sincere spirit to counter man abuse were quickly recruited by Satan, now their goal is to distort the design of God.

God has designed the human being with a male leading and a woman "actively" following.

In the muslim world (subverted by Satan into following 'Hadith' books instead of Quran) Satan made two moves this year through the feminists, Nawal El Saadawi in Egypt is running for president, while Amina Wadud in NY is leading men in prayer, i wonder what is next!

New York Daily news

published on March 19, 2005

http://www.nydailynews.com/ips_rich_content/198-muslimwoman.JPG

BY JORDAN LITE
DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITER Under armed guard, a woman broke with more than a thousand years of Islamic tradition to lead men and women in a prayer service yesterday in Manhattan.

Amina Wadud said she wanted "to remove the artificial and sometimes extremely inconvenient restrictions on the entry and participation of women" in Islam, the fastest-growing religion in the United States.

It is rare for a woman to act publicly as the imam, or prayer leader, at a coed gathering of Muslims. In many American mosques, women must use a separate entrance and prayer space.
---------------------------------------------

[4:34] The men are made responsible for the women, and GOD has endowed them with certain qualities, and made them the bread earners...


Feel free to check my short article on this issue here,

http://www.usn2161.net/womanleadsprayer.html


P.S: The head scarf is a satanic inovation that doesn't belong to the religion of Abraham, "Submission" and could be only found in the Satanic "Hadith" books that the majority of muslims follow instead of the proven Quran.

Draken
03-20-2005, 07:34 AM
That's interesting about the headdress, Ahmad. I know that in countries like for example Uzbekistan were they practice Sufism women don't wear headdresses.
A friend of mine who travelled there not so long ago said he didn't see even one bhurka or other oppressive kind of dress in that part of the world...

KathywithaK
03-20-2005, 01:35 PM
i once knew a man who was unemployed and lazy, and separated from his wife.
one day his children (ages 7 and 9) asked him why he was unemployed, he responded that he cannot answer why God chose this for him, he leaves this up to God.

his children later asked him, why he lives in his van, and he responded that when the time is right, God will find him a home.

when his children asked him why he has no money to feed the family, he responded that when God guides him to a job, he will know that it is the right job and all will be ok again.

when the children asked him why mommy would get mad everytime he stayed out late, he responded that after working all day, a man should be able to have a good time with his friends, God has nothing against this because I worked.

one of the children asked, why then did mommy always work and have money, and payed the bills and put food on the table and never went out, and was sad, we even caught her crying sometimes?

he told them that Satan causes people to do certain things and he makes her sad and angry, these are games Satan plays--we don't want to talk about Satan now---he likes that you know?

"but kids"! he said, daddy will pray to God for mommy so that she doesn't go Satan's way".

so you see people---so with all his shortcomings it is God's doing, we don't question GOD!!!

but when it comes to mommy---it's Satan's doing.

????????? how can anyone play these games with their children? to confuse them. to put a fear of "something" in them. are women so "bad"?

this is a true story i overheard in a park one day by a father who had his children for the weekend. and on weekends they stayed with him in the van, not aloud to "tell mommy" because she would "take them away from him", and therefore she would be doing "Satan's work".

until I stepped in!! and gave his license plate number to social services. with whatever information i gathered: where they went to church, the children's names. and you know what?
he was guilty of mentally and emotionally abusing his children. you might not think so, ask a social worker!!!

KathywithaK
03-20-2005, 01:54 PM
http://muslim-canada.org

then click on "Links To Several Articles About
The Islamic Inst. of Civil Justice

the click on "Social Degradation of Woman-A Crime and Libel on Islam" by Marmaduke Pickthall

Draken
03-20-2005, 03:16 PM
I hate Social Workers. They are exactly that - working for Socialism. They are there to break up families and give illegal power to dumb, powerhungry, bitter, evil people via the State. They are a menace to every loving family that decides to things their way, without them letting the State do it for you.

Have you not read Makow's articles at all?

I read not so long ago that the CIA and FBI encourages people to tell on their neighbours and to keep their eyes and ears open to "suspicious behaviour."

Well done KathywithaK, the State just made you snitch on a fellow man - and for free as well, because I don't imagine you got paid, did you?

At least Judas got 30 gold pieces...

landownunder
03-21-2005, 02:30 AM
Draken,

"A friend of mine who travelled there not so long ago said he didn't see even one bhurka or other oppressive kind of dress in that part of the world"
Why do you associate head drsses or the hijab, or burka for that matter with opression?
Could it not be that these people feel more comfortable and free wearing a hijab or a burka?
Have you ever spoken to a woman wearing a hijab or a burka?
I think It is just your own judgement on behalf of others.

Are nuns also opressed?

Draken
03-21-2005, 03:06 AM
Landownunder!

I'm sorry, my mistake!

Of course, you're right. I am of your opinion as well. Of course headdresses of any kind is not oppressive in itself.
I must have fallen in the trap of letting "politically correct" ways of expression sneak into MY way of expression.

Thanks for pointing out my mistake! :oops:

landownunder
03-21-2005, 05:23 AM
No need to apologize, i think its quite normal to think like that these days.

I myself do not agree with the burka.I think it is over the top for people to cover their faces,how do we know who's under that? Not logic.
But i respect anyones right to be under that, and dont find it opressive.Not upto me to judge..

I thought this article by Henry Makow is the closest non muslims can get to understanding chasteness with Islam, if you have time:

http://www.savethemales.ca/180902.html

Ahmad
03-21-2005, 05:35 AM
Peace,

The ultimate oppression is to institute laws on the people in the name of God, when they are from Satan. Hijab is indeed a sign of oppression, in Hadith books women are equated with inanimate objects (the house) and animals (dogs and horses)! what more evidence do you need than that to understand the evil of Hadith?

Noweher in Quran does God mention the scarf for women, all what is mentioned is to cover their chests and be modest in dressing lengthening their garments, why then do the muslims follow these man-made laws? i think it's about time for you to start questioning your inherited beliefs as i did before you.

The Hadith books have no proof of authenticity, Quran is the only book in the world now that has a physical proof of devine authorship, verify it for yourself.

www.usn2161.net/19miracle.html

buckshotBill
03-21-2005, 11:00 AM
woman leads men in prayer

so what?

anyone can

if you believe in the stuff

ephesians6
03-22-2005, 11:14 AM
The Koran, a total fraud, is a book of deception straight from Satan. God did NOT author this book nor was it inspired by God--only the Holy Bible is divinely inspired.

Satan is a deceiver and he wants to shackle the minds of men into believing lies. Once he has you deceived he can then begin to destroy you. Satan has deceived Ahmed, and he is well on his way to total separation from God in hell. ("And all whose names were not found written in the Lamb's book of life were cast into hell." Revelation)

Don't listen to Ahmed unless you want to share in his fate! Satan has deceived him and now Ahmed wants to deceive you!

You see Ahmed cannot stand up to any criticism or investigation of his Muslim beliefs; he even refuses to disclose what sect of Islam he belongs to! (He reminds me of other deceivers like the Mormons, jehovah Witnesses and others: these deceivers avoid answering the simplest of questions and instead offer, long-winded packaged propaganda. If you ask a man what time is it, and instead he attempts to sell you a defective watch, get away from him.)

Ahmed's avoidance of the truth is a major tip-off that he is separated from the truth. When men dwell in darkness and avoid the light of truth, run away from them.

Ahmed is on this forum to troll for converts to Islam but he will only lead you into misery, deception and ultimately into hell. DON"T LISTEN TO HIS LIES BECAUSE HE WORKS FOR SATAN whether he realizes it or not.

If you are seeking answers to the questions of life, then turn to the Holy Bible and Jesus Christ. Jesus died for your offenses and wickedness, and ONLY THROUGH JESUS CAN YOU BE SAVED. His blood paid the price for your sins! Think about that.

"I am the way, the truth and the life. No man comes to the Father but through me."

There are NO other ways to forgiveness of your sins and eternal life in heaven so don't allow the deceivers like Ahmed, to usher you into making yet another mistake.

Take your problems to Jesus Christ and He will hear you.

Draken
03-22-2005, 01:09 PM
So all those millions of people all over the world who lived and died before the advent of Christianity all went straight to Hell? How about all those millions of people all over the world who don't even know about Christianity; did God decide that they should not even get a chance, and simply cast them down to Hell?

Come on, man... ;-) You jest.

ephesians6
03-22-2005, 08:47 PM
The question of Christ is nothing to "jest" about Draken.

Your questions are valid, however, and there is an answer.

Try reading Romans chapters 1-3 for the complete answer, especially chapter 2.

In essence it says that "knowledge" of right and wrong is "written in the hearts" of men by God, and that men who are without specific understanding (let's say knowledge about Jesus) will be judged based on what knowledge they were given.

If one accepts that God does exist and that He did create the universe, and that He created men from dust, then doesn't it stand to reason that such a powerful God could easily know what was contained in the heart of any man--even those who lived BEFORE Christ revealed Himself to the world?

Moses lived BEFORE Christ came to earth as the revealed Son of God, yet Jesus said that Moses saw Jesus' time and "was glad."

Could God create the earth, the planets, and the suns but be unaware of the secrets, the thoughts and the beliefs contained in men's hearts? Can wicked men hide their wickedness from Him? No.

But you who have knowledge of Christ, and yet reject Him, are without a defense. You will stand accused of rejecting the Savior and be without an excuse before the Lord.

Your question reminds me of those that Jesus received from scoffers and disbelievers who rejected Him. He told them, that if they cannot believe the things He told them about this world, then how could they understand the things that are of heaven!

Don't look for reasons to reject Him, Draken, lest Satan will certainly continue to snare you with deception, doubt and disbelief. Satan wants to lie to you, torment you and then finish you off.

He does this by instilling doubt in one's mind.

Today is the day to believe in the Lord and follow Him.

All that's in balance is your eternal soul!

Draken
03-23-2005, 03:46 AM
You really jump into a LOT of conclusions without anything on your feet, my friend!

My question does not automatically imply I reject Christ and what he said.
On the contrary, next to the Way of Christ there are a few others that also lead to God.
I asked my question because you sound like someone who seems to think there is only ONE way to God and it's through the acceptance of Christ, and Christ ALONE.
I don't agree, but that doesn't mean I REJECT Christ and His message.

DaddyLongLeg
03-23-2005, 04:57 AM
Hello ephesians6

I understand where you are coming from, but you seem to be hung up on religion rather than God. My feeling is that religion is not God but instead a man-made avenue for man to pass judgement on others. As you would know Judgement is reserved for God alone. Religion is a mechanism for man to control man. So you might as well include Christianity amongst all the other religions.

Forget about religion and develop your relationship with God, and you will eventually see what I mean. I think you will ultimately feel at peace with God if you do.

I do not believe that Jesus was a religious man either. He served God, so that is what we should do. Can you see that Jesus was telling us to worship God only? Can you see that worshipping Jesus first is to put God second?

Look at it this way, God created Jesus in His image, just like you and me. Jesus died and I will die too, as will you. That means that we, like Jesus, are beneath God.

Ahmad can probably explain it better than me, but the concept of trinity is actually a pagan belief.

What do you say?

Ahmad
03-23-2005, 06:33 AM
Peace Dave,

There are some primitive tribes in the deep rain forests of Brazil, they know/feel that there is a superhuman entity outthere that governs and controls their forest, rain and their lives. Can anybody imagine these primitive people thinking of such a complicated idea as the "trinity", an idea that even its defenders cannot explain it and when cornered they say, we believe it because it's not understandable!

What is more simple, one god or two, three, three in one gods?

What a blasphemy!, God is beyond our imagination, none equals Him, how could we dare to ascribe mates and sons to Him!

Well said Dave, but i have to say that we are not created in God's image, Quran states that God is beyond anything we can imagine, believing that the Creator is in the form of His creatures is a satanic idea.

[19:88] They said, "The Most Gracious has begotten a son"!

[19:89] You have uttered a gross blasphemy.

[19:90] The heavens are about to shatter, the earth is about to tear asunder, and the mountains are about to crumble.

[19:91] Because they claim that the Most Gracious has begotten a son.

[19:92] It is not befitting the Most Gracious that He should beget a son.

[19:93] Every single one in the heavens and the earth is a servant of the Most Gracious.

[19:94] He has encompassed them, and has counted them one by one.

[19:95] All of them will come before Him on the Day of Resurrection as individuals.

DaddyLongLeg
03-23-2005, 07:39 AM
Hello Ahmad,

I totally agree. The idea that we have been created in Godís image has often been mistaken to mean that we resemble God. I think that it means we were created by Godís design and that this design is Godís physical image for us. In our eyes God has no image.

I think the suggestion that God somehow looks like us is utterly impractical. Not that I am accusing anyone here of such a suggestion, but it definitely is a position adopted by people around the world.

Ahmad
03-23-2005, 07:51 AM
Peace Dave,

A great short article on the greatness of God by the late Rashad Khalifa here, feel free to read/feel it but don't take the verse in the literal sense since elsewhere in Quran God stresses that none equals Him and no vision is able to see Him.

http://www.submission.org/suras/app6.html
P.S: I am not affiliated with the above link.

[39:67] They can never fathom the greatness of GOD. The whole earth is within His fist on the Day of Resurrection. In fact, the universes are folded within His right hand. Be He glorified; He is much too high above needing any partners.

crowneagle
03-23-2005, 09:55 AM
Here's a little piece of wisdom I came across...

SPIRITUALITY VS RELIGION

SPIRITUALITY SAYS THAT GOD IS WITHIN US AND THAT WE DON'T NEED ANYONE ELSE TO MAKE THAT DIVINE CONNECTION FOR US

RELIGION SAYS THAT WE ARE SEPARATED FROM GOD AND THAT WE NEED "THEM" TO MAKE THAT DIVINE CONNECTION

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY SAYS THAT WE ARE FREE TO MAKE CHOICES ON OUR OWN AND THAT WE MUST TAKE PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY FOR OUR ACTIONS

RELIGION SAYS WE MUST MAKE THEIR CHOICES AND ACT THEIR WAY

************************************************

THE THEME OF SPIRITUALITY IS UNCONDITIONAL LOVE

THE THEME OF RELIGION IS FEAR AND GUILT

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY DOES NOT REQUIRE US TO MAKE DONATIONS

RELIGION HAS BECOME BIG BUSINESS

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY SAYS THERE IS NO HELL, NO JUDGEMENT, NO ANGRY GOD... THAT WE ARE LOVED UNCONDITIONALLY

RELIGION SAYS THERE IS A HELL, GOD GETS ANGRY AND JUDGES US... THEREFORE, WE ARE NOT LOVED UNCONDITIONALLY

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY SAYS WE ARE FREE TO CHOOSE OUR OWN PATH TO GOD

RELIGION COMMANDS US TO DO IT THEIR WAY

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY SAYS WE GO TO GOD TO LIGHTEN OUR BURDEN

RELIGION HAS TAUGHT US TO FEAR THEIR GOD

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY SAYS WE SHOULD NOT BE ASHAMED OF OUR SEXUALITY... THAT IT SHOULD BE A SACRED CELEBRATION OF LOVE

RELIGION HAS TAUGHT US TO FEEL ASHAMED, GUILTY AND DIRTY ABOUT OUR SEXUALITY

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY TEACHES US TO HONOR AND RESPECT MOTHER EARTH

RELIGION HAS TOLD US TO "BE THOU FRUITFUL, MULTIPLY AND SUBDUE THE EARTH" I REPEAT... "SUBDUE THE EARTH"

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY REMINDS US THAT WE ARE ONE WITH GOD AND ONE WITH EACH OTHER

RELIGION TEACHES DISUNITY AND SEPARATION WHICH IS THE OPPOSITE OF GOD

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY SAYS GOD IS WITHIN

RELIGION SAYS HE IS IN HEAVEN AND THAT "THEY" ARE THE ONLY INTERMEDIARIES FOR US

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY SAYS WE ARE BORN IN INNOCENCE AND PURITY

RELIGION SAYS WE ARE BORN WITH SIN

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY TEACHES THAT WE ARE ON A LONG SPIRITUAL ADVENTURE AND JOURNEY WHICH WILL ULTIMATELY END BY REUNITING WITH OUR SOURCE

RELIGION SAYS WE'VE GOT ONE LIFE TO GET IT ALL RIGHT AND THERE IS NOTHING BUT HEAVEN OR HELL AFTER THAT

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY SAYS WE ARE FREE TO EXPRESS

RELIGION GAVE US THE DREADED INQUISITION

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY TEACHES UNCONDITIONAL LOVE FOR ALL

RELIGION GAVE US THE CRUSADES IN WHICH MANY WERE KILLED AND SLAUGHTERED IN THE NAME OF GOD

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY TEACHES THAT WE SHOULD LOVE ONE ANOTHER UNCONDITIONALLY AND ALWAYS HONOR THE RIGHTS AND CHOICES OF OTHERS

RELIGION TREATED NATIVE AMERICANS, THE MAYANS AND OTHER INDIGENOUS CULTURES AS SAVAGE PRIMITIVES WHO "MUST BE SAVED"

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY TEACHES PEACE AND HARMONY

RELIGION HAS CAUSED MORE WARS AND MORE KILLING THAN ANY OTHER REASON

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY SAYS RESPECT ALL LIVING THINGS

I NEVER ONCE HEARD ANY RELIGION SAY STOP SLAUGHTERING MILLIONS OF TREES EVERY YEAR FOR CHRIST'S BIRTHDAY

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY TEACHES US TO HAVE FAITH IN OURSELVES

RELIGION TEACHES US TO HAVE FAITH IN THEM

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY SAYS WE HAVE ALL THE ANSWERS... THAT WE CAN FIND THEM BY "GOING WITHIN"

RELIGION TEACHES US THAT IT HAS ALL THE ANSWERS AND ONLY ITS ANSWERS ARE THE RIGHT ONES

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY TEACHES US TO SEARCH FOR THE UNIVERSAL TRUTHS AND OUR HEARTS WILL TELL US WHEN WE HAVE FOUND THEM

RELIGION TEACHES WE HAVE NO CHOICE BUT TO ACCEPT THEIR VERSION OF THE TRUTH

************************************************

WHICH ONE FEELS BETTER TO YOU? SPIRITUALITY OR RELIGION?

GO TO YOUR HEART FOR THE ANSWER. IT WILL NEVER LIE TO YOU

get_real
03-23-2005, 10:25 AM
Crowneagle:

A breath of fresh air!

Thanks, get_real

55132
03-23-2005, 01:44 PM
Crowneagle

at glimpse your post seems enlightened but once read its is pure iluminati thought made to decieve man and send him into darkess.

it is pure gnostiscim

everything you mention is of the satanic realms and totaly contrary to christian thought.

it is all disinfo.


55132

ephesians6
03-23-2005, 02:55 PM
"..next to the Way of Christ there are a few others that also lead to God/...you sound like someone who seems to think there is only ONE way to God and it's through the acceptance of Christ, and Christ ALONE. I don't agree, but that doesn't mean I REJECT Christ and His message." the words of Draken

Yes, you have rejected Christ with your own words! Sorry my friend, but there can be no fence straddling when it comes to Jesus. You either belong to Him or you DON'T!

According to your own words Draken you don't belong to Jesus Christ. You are NOT one of His own because you are essentially saying that His death at the cross was not necessary because you 'believe' there are 'other ways' to God.

(I tried to tell you in a previous email that Satan first works to obtain a stronghold in men's minds through deception. Have you already forgotten that? When men do not hold fast to the Word of God, they submit to Satan and become deceived. Jesus said that Satan was, a liar, a thief and a murderer. Satan already has you deceived, so you are just 2 steps away from destruction! Wake up!)

If there are 'other ways' to God, then Jesus terrible death at the cross was unecessary! His shed blood, according to you, was wasted. But it is ONLY through His shed blood that men can be saved; neither Mohammed, Buddha or any other false prophet or false god can offer you freedom from your sins.

By your own mouth you have confessed that there are 'other ways' to God and that salvation through Christ isn't necessary, but you are deceived once again by the greatest liar of all time.

For Jesus said, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No man comes to the Father but through me."

You will be like the man who stands before Jesus on that coming day, claiming to be one of His own saying, "But I never rejected you. I just believed that there were many ways to God apart FROM YOUR DEATH ON THE CROSS." But He will say to you, "Depart from me wicked man, for I never knew you."

You cannot embrace 'other ways' to God when Christ alone paid the debt for your sins and mine. You blaspheme when you attempt to deceive others with your own confusion and deception. You are in great danger when you deceive others with false doctrines that you subscribe to.

Jesus warned that some will attempt to sneak in to the kingdom without going through the "narrow gate" but they will be rejected.

The Spirit of Christ does not dwell in any man who would claim that there are 'other ways' to salvation besides Christ. You can believe whatever you want to believe, but it is YOU who will pay the price for rejecting Christ.

You are in danger of eternal separation from God, should you die at this moment. The fires of hell are close by for you my dear lost friend. Laugh or scoff all you want, but my words will prove true.

Jesus Christ is the only way to eternal life and all who reject Him, will perish.

What you 'believe' means nothing because your 'beliefs' are based on your own understanding of things which comes from Satanic deception--not on the word of God and the testimony of Christ.

"Lean not unto your own understanding" but trust in the words of the Lord ONLY!

Just remember: You have the power over where you will spend eternity; your fate will depend on the choice that you make. God will not send you to hell, but rather your own rejection of Christ will send you to hell.

I wouldn't want to be without Christ in the coming months and years but the world is full of fools who think that they know more than the Word of God.

ephesians6
03-23-2005, 03:32 PM
Greetings DaddyLongLegs.

I don't preach "religion" but rather the Gospel of Jesus Christ alone.

I could care less about 'religion.' My love is for Christ alone and in seeing that some of you awaken from your deceptions before it's too late.

It amazes me to see the vast muck of foolishness that some here subscribe to, but of course, foolishness and men go together historically. As long as Scripture recounts the follies of men, fools have always followed false gods, self-induced doctrines and dogmas of demons; nothing new under the sun.

I too, once subscribed to a life apart from Christ. I've probably outsinned most of you on this forum; I've broken every commandment that God gave us--every one of them! I was a wicked man and I delighted in evil thoughts and deeds. I plotted and schemed against my foes, and concocted every sort of evil.

But the Lord was patient with me while I strayed and sampled the pleasures of this world for many decades. But He may NOT be as patient with some of you who have rejected His Son.

Here's why: I believed in Jesus when I was only 10 but I strayed away from him for decades. The Lord--in His total understanding of all things in my life--past, present and future--knew that I would return to Him eventually and serve Him. I thank Him for His patience with my sinful ways. Now I live for Him, and try to do His will--not mine.

But some of you here have never believed in or trusted Christ as your Lord and Savior. Some of you will continue to reject Christ right up until your demise. Woe unto you who reject the Lord for your future is hellish; a nightmare that you cannot even begin to imagine.

He knows who will believe and who won't. He knows whose names are written in the book of life. Some of you who are reading this will perish because you have refused to come to Jesus and repent of your sins.

You've been warned over and over, yet you still refuse to come to salvation and redemption through Jesus.

You want to do things your own way; you refuse to submit to the Lord and His word; some of you want to follow deceiving doctrines of demons and pray to false gods.

But someone out there knows that I am speaking the truth. For you, trust in the Lord and be saved. Jesus loves you more than you can even begin to conceive; that's why He died for us on the cross, so that we could be freed from our sins which will lead us to spiritual death. "The wages of sin is death."

No sin is too great for Him to forgive. No life is too wicked that He cannot change if you will only submit to Him.

Trsut in the Lord ONLY and be saved.

Draken
03-23-2005, 03:35 PM
"Lean not unto your own understanding" but trust in the words of the Lord ONLY!"

And that Lord is YOU?

Look. If you want to put words in my mouth to make it easier to attack me or reject "my belief", then really there's no point in me discussing religious matters with you.

You can't shove your belief down people's throats. I mean, really do you think what you say is SO brilliant that I will suddenly fall over backwards and "realize" you're right, even if I DO agree with you? I don't even know if you are who you say you are! We are anonymous people discussing matters without having a clue about eachother's true identity. Do you think under such circumstances I will just accept YOUR point of view?

I don't think so.

You don't know me anymore than I know you, so stop telling people they're going to Hell because YOU say so, because who are YOU?

People who THINK they are right should stop in their tracks and think again. One should NEVER stop questioning ONESELF.

Paris_hawks
03-23-2005, 03:38 PM
"What you 'believe' means nothing because your 'beliefs' are based on your own understanding of things which comes from Satanic deception--not on the word of God and the testimony of Christ." - Ephesians6

Are you saying that no one can discern the truth for themselves or they are being led by Satan?, and only if you listen to what someone else commands you then you are following the word of God?...

I pray that you would learn to Edify, uplift, and encourage your brothers and sisters rather than continually cast down judgement, threatening anyone who has an opinion with getting roasted in fire and brimstone.

Please man...do you believe others will percieve you as a follower of Christ when you speak with hateful language?

I also wish that you would realize that many of your views are not 'truth' but opinions..."judge not, or you will also be judged"
peace

crowneagle
03-23-2005, 04:24 PM
Well, first of all, I'm not a Christian according to the popular definition, and will never be one. However, I have great respect for true Christianity and the real teachings of Jesus. I also know many people of the Christian faith that are spiritually very evolved. I remember making a posting earlier on a Catholic Father that I knew in India, who can actually manifest Light coming from his heart when he reads the Bible. I consider only people of such calibre to be truly qualified to teach others about Christianity. All others IMO that keep ranting about their dogmatic preachings without actually developing a Christlike nature are nothing but mind-controlled slaves belonging to the cult of "Churchianity".

The gentleman I was referring to is a true devotee of Jesus Christ. I even got a chance to talk to him and ask him how he accomplished it. He replied very humbly that there's nothing very "special" about him, and that all he did was to dedicate every little action of his to Jesus Christ, including little things like breathing, eating, lifting of objects and sleeping. Everytime he did these things he mentally affirmed that it was Jesus that did all the things, not him.

Through the constant practice of this discipline which sounds very simple, yet very challenging, he came to a point where his mind, heart and soul was involuntarily one with Jesus EVERY moment of his life. And no wonder Jesus blesses him abundantly.

This is what true submission to Jesus Christ is all about anyway. I'm also aware that the Orthodox Church does teach the importance of devotion. Also, this gentleman has unconditional love for all living beings, and manifests it in his actions. He does not claim that his way is the only way, and has respect and tolerance for all faiths, as he understands the true essence of his faith. As one progresses further and gets closer and closer to one's innermost source, the outer dogmatism automatically drops off.

True spirituality is about developing spiritual qualities such as unconditional love for all beings; a constant quest to be in touch with God; an ever-increasing faith in God; a constant effort at self-improvement and becoming a better person; and receptiveness to guidance from God at every moment of one's life. Jesus was one such great soul that exemplified this through his own actions, and set an example for others to follow. And anyone that follows this example receives the gift of being one with the Holy Spirit. Such a person is unperturbed by the ups and downs of the outer circumstances; rejoices in Divine Bliss; very rarely gets angry; and has full faith that God will take care of his needs in abundance. And I've seen this Father manifest it in his own actions.

Real Christianity has nothing to do with dogmatism. Dogmatism might serve an important purpose in the beginning, as only then a person can become focussed on one path. And as the person progresses further and gets closer to the source, the outer forms are discarded. On the other hand, if the person is too stuck up in outer forms without achieving inner growth through a constant effort at developing divine qualities, then he only ends up becoming a mind-controlled fanatic nut under some form of a "mental drug addiction".

I know that there are many fanatics that self-righteously try to force their dogma on other people's throats, without any idea of what true spirituality is about. I'm sorry to say this, but don't ever expect me to take you seriously.

55132
03-23-2005, 05:55 PM
Crowneagle

man is free to belive what he wants to but not free to decieve. what you expose is not christianity but a counterfit based on hinduism, gnosticism, masonry new age or if you wish. if you cannot tell the difference it's probably because you have not read the scriptures.

what christianity is, is written in the bible and no where else. no private what i believe, you belive or any other person believes is biblicaly acceptable.


check
http://cana.userworld.com/cana_chart.html

55132

ephesians6
03-23-2005, 06:04 PM
"..next to the Way of Christ there are a few others that also lead to God/...you sound like someone who seems to think there is only ONE way to God and it's through the acceptance of Christ, and Christ ALONE. I don't agree, but that doesn't mean I REJECT Christ and His message." the words of Draken


Once again, I post your own words as evidence of your rejection of Christ as the ONLY Savior sent to this world, Draken. No one has "placed words" in your mouth, you simply don't want to hear the truth.

You said that you "don't agree" that Jesus "is the ONLY way to God." Correct?

But Jesus said, "No man comes to the Father but through me."

Are we to assume then, that you are wiser and know more than Christ?

Trust me, you and your words will be dead and forgotten in due time, but the words of the Lord will remain forever.

I've spoken the truth to you and told you what you must do to be saved but you have become angry and rattled. You don't retain wisdom very long do you?

Didn't I tell you that Jesus said that Satan has 3 goals for men? Deception, theft and destruction! Satan has a grip on you Draken; he has your mind firmly in his grasp and he has stolen your salvation because you have allowed him to do so. He will destroy you next!

Christ alone has the power to save you but if you continue to reject Him and His word, you will perish.

Would you prefer to hear Jesus say it? Here it is:

"And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire." Revelation 20:15

If this makes you angry, then take it up with Christ, for He wrote it. I'm just passing it on to you because I don't want to see you perish.

Get on your knees in a quiet place and plead forgiveness of your sins before the Lord. He will hear you and forgive you. And then "pick up your cross" and "follow" Him all the days of your life.

Christ is searching for workers to spread His truth to the lost. Why don't you become one?

ephesians6
03-23-2005, 06:31 PM
CrownEagle says, "I remember making a posting earlier on a Catholic Father that I knew in India, who can actually manifest Light coming from his heart when he reads the Bible. I consider only people of such calibre to be truly qualified to teach others about Christianity."


If you seek out or you are impressed by such 'signs' then you need to know that even Satan can manifest as a brilliant 'light.'

His power domain is replete with supernatural 'signs' and 'wonders' which are deceptions meant to snare the biblically ignorant.

Do you not know that Jesus WARNED US IN MATTHEW 24--THREE TIMES--TO NOT BE DECEIVED during the end times?

How foolish some of you are. I've told you over and over that Satan is a deceiver and many of you are easy marks for his schemes because you do not know the word of God. If Satan has some of you under such deception NOW, while we are still living in the age of grace, then just wait until the Beast (antichrist) is unleashed!

Many of you will gladly take the 'mark of the beast' because you'll allow your eyes to further deceive you as he performs false miracles. You'd better get your noses into the word of God and I mean fast!

Have you not heard that we battle against "principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness, against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the air?" Ephesians6:12

Do you not know that Satan is called, "the prince of the air" and that it has been given unto him special powers to confuse and amaze men with his supernatural powers?

Jesus said that those who "seek signs" are a wicked and perverse generation.

CrownEagle, if you allow the supernatural 'signs' such as a "light" eminating from a man's chest, then you will serve the Beast in the future because you believe your eyes and not the word of God.

But I assure you, your eyes will deceive you and if you take the mark of the Beast, you will perish.

ephesians6
03-23-2005, 07:03 PM
"You can't shove your belief down people's throats."

Nor am I trying to. Acceptance of Christ as your Savior is a voluntary action. But in these days of wickedness, ignorance and deception, with Christ's return nearing, there is no time to coddle the lost with sermons that don't convict them of their sins and their need for Christ.

"I mean, really do you think what you say is SO brilliant that I will suddenly fall over backwards and "realize" you're right, even if I DO agree with you?"

I've never thought of myself as "brilliant" nor do I have any particular persuasive powers. It is the moving of the Holy Spirit of Christ that must convict you of your sins and your need for Him. I could write a million words but I can't move your heart; only the Holy Spirit can do that.

Draken, it is NOT my responsibility to see that you accept Christ. That is your decision alone; neither the Lord nor myself can force you, nor would we want to see you forced. You must come to the understanding that you are a sinful man and be convicted in your spirit that you need Jesus. My job is to toss out the seeds and pray that they take root.

Jesus gave an excellent sermon about the various types of "soil" that the seeds fall upon. Some soil takes the seed and sprouts; some soil is rocky and will not accept the seeds; while other seeds sprout a little and then die. (I urge you to read that chapter--I'll locate it if you like.)

"I don't even know if you are who you say you are!"

Who have I said that I am? I've admitted that I was an utterly wicked and sinful man who strayed away from Christ for a long time. I have returned to Him and I serve Him only. I am trying to follow the 2nd law that Jesus gave--"Love your neighbor as you love yourself."

If I didn't love you, and others on this forum, I would not spend any time telling you about Christ. The wicked don't care if you perish--but I do care about you and your eternity. Why? Because when one realizes all that Jesus has done for them, they cannot help but tell others about Him.

I don't want Satan to take you into hell with him. I would like to meet you one day in paradise so we can celebrate together. Will you be there?

Jesus told those who would follow Him, that we are to preach the Gospel to the ends of the earth, and then the end shall come.

If you doubt anything that I have told you, then by all means dig out your Bible and see for yourself if what I've said is truthful or not.

Read the book of John; that's a good place to start.

Draken
03-24-2005, 01:09 AM
Look.

Once and for all:

the only thing I doubt is that your interpretation of The Scriptures is The Right one.

When you say "see for yourself what Christ said" I read the same words as you but interpret it differently from you. I have my reasons for that.

You make a lot of assumptions and don't even notice putting words in my mouth. So you interpret what I say and misunderstand exactly the same way you say I interpret and misunderstand the Bible.

DarkChilde3D
03-24-2005, 02:21 AM
I've noticed that this thread is recieving a lot of hang time, and I couldn't help but chime in.

I do not have a problem with women working, leading prayer, being in public office, etc.

The problem I have is that women recieve what they think is preferential treatment by the government in America. The zero tolerance bullshit and all . . . I don't care who you are . . . anybody is capable of desrving a smack. But men normally won't do this . . . I know I won't. If I were to slap my wife, her head would probably twist 180 degrees. But back to the point . . .

It seems that every law being put on the books these days is designed to make money for the state, or for lawyers, or both. A zero tolerance policy means that if your neighbor heard you yelling at your wife because you came home to find her fucking another man . . . the husband goes to jail until the trial is over. If a husband goes to work all day while his wife is home being a prima donna and fucking the pool-boy, I believe it should not only be the husbands right and privlige to slap her around, but it should be his duty to do so. What kind of unappreciative bitch gets all her bills paid, the clothes on her back, the roof over her head, and any other expense she could think of incurring paid for . . . to have an excuse like 'I'm bored' to go cheat on her husband? When the fuck did 'I was bored' become a vaiable excuse? If a guy does it, he has to leave his own home and pay half. If the woman cheats, the man still has to leave home and pay half. How is this beneficial to society?

Ya know, this country is going to get so bad one day, that all the people in the surrounding states about washington d.c. are going to storm the white house one day, and lynch all of these motherfuckers that are turning our society to shit. I'd be more than happy to coordinate any two teams into the place, as well. I have paramilitary infiltration/asault experience . . . it may be in just paintball, but I have more wins as a leader than losses.

What we need to do here is the same thing they did to that French queen . . . they took her out and took her head off. We need a mob to go in, get the president, and bring him out to the white house lawn and set him up on the guillatine. And then we have to send a message to all these would be politicians . . . "Fuck our life up by voting for your interests instead of ours, and we'll cut your fucking head off."

The people of this country need to go on the offensive here. the problem is, 'nobody cares.' How can a white man fight alongside a black man when the blacks get preferential treatment via affirmative action? The black man is digging this, and wont fight. The Mexicans and other Latinos feel special as well for similar, albiet different reasons. And women can run around rampant, doing whatever the fuck they want, because its good to be a bitch these days. Its not the rest of the people that typically see this as a problem . . . it is, yet again, time to "Take up the White Man's Burden." Except this time, we're not taking the rights from 'savages'. . . we're trying to get them back for ourselves.

There is no peaceful means by which to do this . . . because the enemy is hostile. He has hostilly taken over this country. He is hostilly repressing us all, and hiding it in the guise of 'this is good.' He is hostilly policing us and driving us broke with his taxes, and fines, and court costs, and medical fees. He controls the corporations and the government. His name is Satan. And, unfortunately, we've allowed him to have too much power to be talked to or ignored. We have to beat the shit out of this monkey that sits on all our backs.

Either this, or it would seem that America is going to fall flat on its ass. America is going to be defeated. The corruption in the government goes up so high, and so far, that our prime directives are all fucked up. Since when do we give foreigners free education, and turn our backs on our own kids? (which is another point I want to make.)

Someone said to me that there is no such thing as a free education that we pay for for foreigners. Sure there is.

Hindus and Filipinos come into this country. They get school loans. They then graduate and go back to their country. They then take our work from us via outsourcing. Then when the bank tries to collect the debt from little Hadgie, he curls his nose and gives the bank the middle finger. There is nothing the bank can do . . . the bank is here, and the kid is there. In effect, the bank has to find a way to fill in the void thats been left in its precious bottom line. So it takes it from Americans in the form of high interest rates, ATM fees, and they resort to this Universal Late payment bullshit (READ UP ON THIS IF YOU HAVE MORE THAN ONE CREDIT CARD! Bisicly it means if you pay one credit card late, all of the credit card companies that you hold in your wallet can each charge you a seperate late fee for each card you hold. This is the TRUTH, people!)

I'm going to close out saying that,

Ahmad, although I applaud you for being able to get down on your knees and stick your ass in the air in prayer and have not a single violent thought in your head, you cannot get an absentee landlord to fix a heater. God has allowed the Devil to reign on this earth. It is our job to denounce and destroy him. We cannot leave it up to God, because this is OUR test to take, not His.

marypoppinz, I know your intentions are to make life safe for your kids . . . but this is not enough. We all have to make life safe for all of mankind. So lets not just stop with the child molesters . . . lets get all of these corrupt bastards and bitches, shove a glass rod up each one of their penises or pussies, and smash the glass inside. The problems your kids are having are not the only problems in the world.

And anyone else that thinks I'm off the deep end here . . . SHOW ME ANOTHER SOLUTION . . . and not just a suggestion . . . show me something with some thought behind it . . . show me a plan with a 5 year period of projections, then a 10 year period of projections.

I'm not saying that we shouldn't pray to God. But we cannot ask God to fix this. We made this mess. Satan didn't do this . . . he needed US to take the suggestion. He needed US to ACCEPT him. He needed US to let down our guard, so that he may posess our thoughts and our deeds. And how do we prevent any deadly disease from overtaking society? We have to quarantene it. Gues what? Our entire federal hub is loaded with it, and every corporation is a festering boil that distributes it. Wh must either kill the disease, or we must cut off its power supply.

Now we can educate as many people as we want . . . and its true that knowledge is power . . . but we must exercise that power. We must know the difference between the innocently ignorant, and the flat out abusers of the system. And then we must know who to destroy and how to do it. That is the only way we can stop this shit . . . and there will be many casualties along the way . . . but its something we must do for the perpetuation of the species, and we must also do it this way in order for us to be able to evolve into the next level of our biological destiny, as written by God.

Draken
03-24-2005, 02:51 AM
Thanks for taking us back to the issue, DC!

And anyone else that thinks I'm off the deep end here . . . SHOW ME ANOTHER SOLUTION . . . and not just a suggestion . . . show me something with some thought behind it . . . show me a plan with a 5 year period of projections, then a 10 year period of projections.

I know what would bring the System down: DON'T VOTE.

If the people of America would stop delegating their power to representatives who represent nothing but the abusers of the System through the peoples' delegation of its powers, then the System would come crashing down in a few years.

As long as the masses keep buying the bluff that "voting is a right that MUST be exercised" the politicians don't care who the masses vote for since the fact they vote in the first place gives them the fuel they need, namely the consent of the people for status quo.

If the people would exercise their right NOT to vote (because let's face it, the most competent, spiritually upright candidates simply are not ALLOWED to participate, so there really isn't anyone to vote for who is not the NWO's puppet) the people would take away the one thing the Elite needs to control the masses - CONSENT.

<a href="http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig/shaffer1.html">Why I Do Not Vote by Butler Shaffer</a>

<a href="http://www.geocities.com/integral_tradition/elections.html">Elections by Francis Parker Yockey</a>

Ahmad
03-24-2005, 08:15 AM
Peace Crowneagle,

What Satan did is exactly this, subverted the one religion of God (into three main disputing religions ) giving it an ugly image, thus he divided the united nation of human beings into two camps, the fundamentalists (conservative hypocrites) who stick to a false dogma (e.g: the subverted religions), and the rest are driven into the disbelieving camp (Secular, liberal, no god, new age spirituality).

The truth is inbetween those two camps, it is the middle lane, God calls His nation "the middle nation" that has only God as its center, not a dogma nor an ego.

The article you quote is a perfect example, it gives us a glimpse into the two disputing factions in the world today, the liberals and the conservatives.
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SPIRITUALITY & RELIGION VS Submission

SPIRITUALITY SAYS THAT GOD IS WITHIN US AND THAT WE DON'T NEED ANYONE ELSE TO MAKE THAT DIVINE CONNECTION FOR US

RELIGION SAYS THAT WE ARE SEPARATED FROM GOD AND THAT WE NEED "THEM" TO MAKE THAT DIVINE CONNECTION

Submission says that God is a separate entity of His creation, but He is nearer to us than the jugular vein, He hears and responds to our prayers, there are no barriers between us and God.

[50:16] We created the human, and we know what he whispers to himself. We are closer to him than his jugular vein.

[2:186] When My servants ask you about Me, I am always near. I answer their prayers when they pray to Me. The people shall respond to Me and believe in Me, in order to be guided.

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY SAYS THAT WE ARE FREE TO MAKE CHOICES ON OUR OWN AND THAT WE MUST TAKE PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY FOR OUR ACTIONS

RELIGION SAYS WE MUST MAKE THEIR CHOICES AND ACT THEIR WAY

Submission says that WE are responsible, no soul can carry the sins of another, God warns against following blindly the professional religionsists, because if we take their word and laws instead of God's, since that means they are our gods.

[17:36] You shall not accept any information, unless you verify it for yourself. I have given you the hearing, the eyesight, and the brain, and you are responsible for using them.

[9:31] They have set up their religious leaders and scholars as lords, instead of GOD. Others deified the Messiah, son of Mary. They were all commanded to worship only one god. There is no god except He. Be He glorified, high above having any partners.

[42:21] They follow idols who decree for them religious laws never authorized by GOD. If it were not for the predetermined decision, they would have been judged immediately. Indeed, the transgressors have incurred a painful retribution.

[35:18] No soul can carry the sins of another soul. If a soul that is loaded with sins implores another to bear part of its load, no other soul can carry any part of it, even if they were related. The only people to heed your warnings are those who reverence their Lord, even when alone in their privacy, and observe the Contact Prayers (Salat). Whoever purifies his soul, does so for his own good. To GOD is the final destiny.


************************************************

THE THEME OF SPIRITUALITY IS UNCONDITIONAL LOVE

THE THEME OF RELIGION IS FEAR AND GUILT

The theme of Submission is REVERENCE OF GOD, which means that we love God the most, we respect Him the most, we revere Him and know how severe His retribution. The deal was clear, you will get two messages one from God and one from Satan, and you reap what you sow, the guilty will choose hell voluntarily because of their inability to come closer to God on the judgment day, hell already surrounds them because of their transgressions. Unconditional love spoils, God's love is indeed conditional but within everybody's reach.

[59:18] O you who believe, you shall reverence GOD, and let every soul examine what it has sent ahead for tomorrow. You shall reverence GOD; GOD is fully Cognizant of everything you do.

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY DOES NOT REQUIRE US TO MAKE DONATIONS

RELIGION HAS BECOME BIG BUSINESS

In Submission, the obligatory charity (Zakaa, 2.5% of any income we get) goes strictly to these specific groups, other than that the believers shall spend in the cause of God on their own volition.

[2:215] They ask you about giving: say, "The charity you give shall go to the parents, the relatives, the orphans, the poor, and the traveling alien." Any good you do, GOD is fully aware thereof.

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY SAYS THERE IS NO HELL, NO JUDGEMENT, NO ANGRY GOD... THAT WE ARE LOVED UNCONDITIONALLY

RELIGION SAYS THERE IS A HELL, GOD GETS ANGRY AND JUDGES US... THEREFORE, WE ARE NOT LOVED UNCONDITIONALLY


The theme of "unconditional love" is the slogan of Satan's secular extremists, they want a license to sin. In Submission though, we know the deal that we chose to accept, that we are responsible, if we do good we will get double the rewards and if we transgress we get the just requital, without God's judging in the resurrectionb day there would be no meaning for this life, the test would be pointless.

[47:15] The allegory of Paradise that is promised for the righteous is this: it has rivers of unpolluted water, and rivers of fresh milk, and rivers of wine - delicious for the drinkers - and rivers of strained honey. They have all kinds of fruits therein, and forgiveness from their Lord. (Are they better) or those who abide forever in the hellfire, and drink hellish water that tears up their intestines?

************************************************
SPIRITUALITY SAYS WE ARE FREE TO CHOOSE OUR OWN PATH TO GOD

RELIGION COMMANDS US TO DO IT THEIR WAY

Submission says that there is one path to God, and it is to submit to His will, believe His messages and messengers, believe in the judgment day (that we will be held accountable for every deed), this path is the path of Abraham, "Submission", it is the "straight path" the shortest to God.

[30:30] Therefore, you shall devote yourself to the religion of strict monotheism. Such is the natural instinct placed into the people by GOD. Such creation of GOD will never change. This is the perfect religion, but most people do not know.

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY SAYS WE GO TO GOD TO LIGHTEN OUR BURDEN

RELIGION HAS TAUGHT US TO FEAR THEIR GOD

Submission says that the human being is either "appreciative" of God alone by relating all the good things to Him alone (and by revering only God) or unappreciative, which means failing to acknowledge God's hand behind everything, both of them get their just requital or reward according to their deeds, reverence is a mix of deep love, awe and respect, a positive kind of fear.

[14:7] Your Lord has decreed: "The more you thank Me, the more I give you." But if you turn unappreciative, then My retribution is severe.

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY SAYS WE SHOULD NOT BE ASHAMED OF OUR SEXUALITY... THAT IT SHOULD BE A SACRED CELEBRATION OF LOVE

RELIGION HAS TAUGHT US TO FEEL ASHAMED, GUILTY AND DIRTY ABOUT OUR SEXUALITY

Submission doesn't deny this aspect of our humanity nor does it indulge in it, submitters look for the meaning behind the physical actions in order to find God, the source of all the righteous meanings and feelings. Thus love is the point not the physical relationship which doesn't last. Self indulgence is the main sign of transgression and enslavement by Satan.

[30:21] Among His proofs is that He created for you spouses from among yourselves, in order to have tranquility and contentment with each other, and He placed in your hearts love and care towards your spouses. In this, there are sufficient proofs for people who think.

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY TEACHES US TO HONOR AND RESPECT MOTHER EARTH

RELIGION HAS TOLD US TO "BE THOU FRUITFUL, MULTIPLY AND SUBDUE THE EARTH" I REPEAT... "SUBDUE THE EARTH"

Eventhough God has subdued the earth for us, He didn't give us permission to corrupt it, the submitters are strictly warned against any kind of transgression, the very act of taking more than your needs (exhausting the resources) is condemned repeatedly in Quran, for example...

[20:81] Eat from the good things we provided for you, and do not transgress, lest you incur My wrath. Whoever incurs My wrath has fallen.

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY REMINDS US THAT WE ARE ONE WITH GOD AND ONE WITH EACH OTHER

RELIGION TEACHES DISUNITY AND SEPARATION WHICH IS THE OPPOSITE OF GOD

The secular extreme wants it a "pleasant ville" where all are equal, the good and the bad, as for the fundamentalists they want it a mor in your face hirarchy with masters and slaves (or religionsists and gentiles). As for Submission, God says that the believers in HIm are united in one column unlike the disbelievers who will stay divided because of the different idols they worship (which causes a conflict of interests). My message is nothing but a call for unity, i am to proclaim a "united Submitters nation" for the believers in God alone.


[b][3:104] Let there be a community of you who invite to what is good, advocate righteousness, and forbid evil. These are the winners.[3:105] Do not be like those who became divided and disputed, despite the clear proofs that were given to them. For these have incurred a terrible retribution.

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY SAYS GOD IS WITHIN

RELIGION SAYS HE IS IN HEAVEN AND THAT "THEY" ARE THE ONLY INTERMEDIARIES FOR US

Submission says there are no intermediaries, even the messengers themselves cannot intercede for anyone for the simple reason that they are totally powerless to grant any kind of help to anyone, not Muhammad, Jesus nor the saints, not any human being who ever did or will exist can step between us and God.

[39:43] Have they invented intercessors to mediate between them and GOD? Say, "What if they do not possess any power, nor understanding?"

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY SAYS WE ARE BORN IN INNOCENCE AND PURITY

RELIGION SAYS WE ARE BORN WITH SIN

In Submission, the original sin has been forgiven for all of us (which was the initial belief in Satan's claim that the creatures have inherent independent powers), however we are born to this world to make a final decision, God or Satan, like a make up test. The record on earth starts from Zero. the originla sin was forgiven...

[7:22] He thus duped them with lies. As soon as they tasted the tree, their bodies became visible to them, and they tried to cover themselves with the leaves of Paradise. Their Lord called upon them: "Did I not enjoin you from that tree, and warn you that the devil is your most ardent enemy?" [7:23] They said, "Our Lord, we have wronged our souls, and unless You forgive us and have mercy on us, we will be losers." [7:24] He said, "Go down as enemies of one another. On earth shall be your habitation and provision for awhile." [7:25] He said, "On it you will live, on it you will die, and from it you will be brought out."

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY TEACHES THAT WE ARE ON A LONG SPIRITUAL ADVENTURE AND JOURNEY WHICH WILL ULTIMATELY END BY REUNITING WITH OUR SOURCE

RELIGION SAYS WE'VE GOT ONE LIFE TO GET IT ALL RIGHT AND THERE IS NOTHING BUT HEAVEN OR HELL AFTER THAT

Submission says that all the human (and Jinn) beings will ultimately return to God, however only a few believe in this and that's why they will be admitted closer to God after Judgment (Paradise is the place close to God) as for those who don't believe in being judged by God, they will run away in fear on the judgment day and hell will be that place away from God.

[9:105] Say, "Work righteousness; GOD will see your work, and so will His messenger and the believers. Ultimately, you will be returned to the Knower of all secrets and declarations, then He will inform you of everything you had done."

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY SAYS WE ARE FREE TO EXPRESS

RELIGION GAVE US THE DREADED INQUISITION

Submission makes distinction between righteous expression, and sinful one. What kind of society would be that allows evil to spread in the name of tolerance and freedom of expression. However everyone in his privacy can do what he want, God is witness over us all, but to proclaim your sin is simply an invitation for the others to join you and that's why God exorts the believers to invite to the good and forbid evil lest it spreads.

[24:19] Those who love to see immorality spread among the believers have incurred a painful retribution in this life and in the Hereafter. GOD knows, while you do not know.

[3:104] Let there be a community of you who invite to what is good, advocate righteousness, and forbid evil. These are the winners.

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY TEACHES UNCONDITIONAL LOVE FOR ALL

RELIGION GAVE US THE CRUSADES IN WHICH MANY WERE KILLED AND SLAUGHTERED IN THE NAME OF GOD


In Submission, war is allowed only for self defense or to eliminate oppression, individual freedoms including the right to believe in whatever you want are protected in Quran.

[2:190] You may fight in the cause of GOD against those who attack you, but do not aggress. GOD does not love the aggressors.
[2:191] You may kill those who wage war against you, and you may evict them
whence they evicted you. Oppression is worse than murder. Do not fight them at the Sacred Masjid, unless they attack you therein. If they attack you, you may kill them. This is the just retribution for those disbelievers.
[2:192] If they refrain, then GOD is Forgiver, Most Merciful.
[2:193] You may also fight them to eliminate oppression, and to worship GOD freely. If they refrain, you shall not aggress; aggression is permitted only against the aggressors.

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY TEACHES THAT WE SHOULD LOVE ONE ANOTHER UNCONDITIONALLY AND ALWAYS HONOR THE RIGHTS AND CHOICES OF OTHERS

RELIGION TREATED NATIVE AMERICANS, THE MAYANS AND OTHER INDIGENOUS CULTURES AS SAVAGE PRIMITIVES WHO "MUST BE SAVED"

In Submission, the greeting decreed by God is "Peace be unto you", no agression is allowed whatsoever, there is no compulsion in religion.

[2:256] There shall be no compulsion in religion: the right way is now distinct from the wrong way. Anyone who denounces the devil and believes in GOD has grasped the strongest bond; one that never breaks. GOD is Hearer, Omniscient.

[60:8] GOD does not enjoin you from befriending those who do not fight you because of religion, and do not evict you from your homes. You may befriend them and be equitable towards them. GOD loves the equitable.

************************************************

SPIRITUALITY TEACHES PEACE AND HARMONY

RELIGION HAS CAUSED MORE WARS AND MORE KILLING THAN ANY OTHER REASON


[5:64] The Jews even said, "GOD's hand is tied down!" It is their hands that are tied down. They are condemned for uttering such a blasphemy. Instead, His hands are wide open, spending as He wills. For certain, your Lord's revelations to you will cause many of them to plunge deeper into transgression and disbelief. Consequently, we have committed them to animosity and hatred among themselves until the Day of Resurrection. Whenever they ignite the flames of war, GOD puts them out. They roam the earth wickedly, and GOD dislikes the evildoers.

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SPIRITUALITY TEACHES US TO HAVE FAITH IN OURSELVES

RELIGION TEACHES US TO HAVE FAITH IN THEM


Submission teaches us to have faith in God alone

[33:3] And put your trust in GOD. GOD suffices as an advocate.

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SPIRITUALITY SAYS WE HAVE ALL THE ANSWERS... THAT WE CAN FIND THEM BY "GOING WITHIN"

RELIGION TEACHES US THAT IT HAS ALL THE ANSWERS AND ONLY ITS ANSWERS ARE THE RIGHT ONES

Submission says that only God has the answers and only by asking Him can we be inspired by the correct ones, furthermore God has sent all humanity a proven final testament (Quran)that it may guide them to the righteous answers. The book sets you free of needing to ask anyone, it is between you and God alone.(the messengers provide answers from Quran if the believers couldn't find them.

[2:97] Say, "Anyone who opposes Gabriel should know that he has brought down this (Quran) into your heart, in accordance with GOD's will, confirming previous scriptures, and providing guidance and good news for the believers."

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SPIRITUALITY TEACHES US TO SEARCH FOR THE UNIVERSAL TRUTHS AND OUR HEARTS WILL TELL US WHEN WE HAVE FOUND THEM

RELIGION TEACHES WE HAVE NO CHOICE BUT TO ACCEPT THEIR VERSION OF THE TRUTH

Submission warns against following our parents (or anyone else) blindly, every individual is responsible for himsels, no soul can carry the burden of another. Everyone wil get two messages in his lifetime, one from Satan and one from God and he or she is totally free to choose between them.

[2:170] When they are told, "Follow what GOD has revealed herein," they say, "We follow only what we found our parents doing." What if their parents did not understand, and were not guided?

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For mor analysis of Satan's trick to drive the people away from God and His message, feel free to read this article,

http://www.usn2161.net/isreligionevil.html

nohope187
03-24-2005, 05:46 PM
Hey DC, I kinda like your idea of violent revolution, but isn't that what the globalists would want to justify a police state? You do see the catch 22 we're in, right? But yeah, I would rather be doing somethin' about it along with what you had in mind, than sitting here feeling helpless.

DarkChilde3D
03-25-2005, 10:47 AM
This may be true, but the 5% of the total population running this shit would have a very hard time keeping police control over 95% totalling the rest of the population. They'd have to nuke their own investment in order to stop us.

nohope187
03-25-2005, 06:29 PM
DarkChilde3D wrote:
This may be true, but the 5% of the total population running this shit would have a very hard time keeping police control over 95% totalling the rest of the population. They'd have to nuke their own investment in order to stop us. What makes you think they wouldn't want to nuke us when they want at least 80 percent of the world's population dead. It's all about population control, man! They do have their underground cities to live in, if and when the land is unlivable due to radiation half-life:-P