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Ahmad
01-01-2005, 12:20 PM
In the name of God, The Gracious, The Merciful



Peace,


As for the Quake issue, as i said before, God is the One who brings it, as for me i deliver the signs and proofs and then wait for the fulfilment of the prophecy. I have no doubt in my heart that the Quake promised to put an end to Satan's kingdom will come at the right time. The proofs are on my website and they are beyond my ability to fabricate, i believe they are from God.

As for Jesus, i will say the following only for the sake of the truth, i don't like to argue with those whose minds are sealed and follow only CONJECTURE.

[4:171] O people of the scripture, do not transgress the limits of your religion, and do not say about GOD except the truth. The Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, was a messenger of GOD, and His word that He had sent to Mary, and a revelation from Him. Therefore, you shall believe in GOD and His messengers. You shall not say, "Trinity." You shall refrain from this for your own good. GOD is only one god. Be He glorified; He is much too glorious to have a son. To Him belongs everything in the heavens and everything on earth. GOD suffices as Lord and Master.
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First i would like to say that there are two mindsets in this world, the one who believes that there is only ONE truth (thus One god) and the one who believes truth is relative (no distinct right and wrong) thus multiple gods. The first mindest is called "Submission" and the second is called "Idol-worship".

I will begin with this verse that describes this issue accurately:

Qur'an [39:29] GOD cites the example of a man who deals with disputing partners, compared to a man who deals with only one consistent source. Are they the same? Praise be to GOD; most of them do not know.


We should reflect carefully on this example, the above two categories manifest themselves in all aspects of life,


CATEGORY # 1 (anything goes mentality):

1-The man who deals with disputing partners: e.g: multiple gods (Jesus+god), (Muhammad+god), (different saints and professional religionsists), (Isis, Osiris, Amon, Ishtar....etc), (the buddhists' gods).....etc


2- The man who deals with disputing books: e.g: (Torah+Talmoud), (Gospel+Church traditions), (Quran+Hadith).

Conclusion: to prefer to deal with two or more sources is typical mindset of an idol-worshiper (e.g: Adultery). A ship with two captains will eventually sink because of disputes, a family with both the man and the woman ruling will ultimately fall because of disputes...etc.
-------------------

CATEGORY # 2 (Black&White mentality):

1- The man who deals only with one god: God alone, with no partners.

[17:42] Say, "If there were any other gods beside Him, as they claim, they would have tried to overthrow the Possessor of the throne."



2- The man who deals only with one book: Quran, the fianl testament, the only available book with a built in proof of devine authorship.

(Eventhough the Torah and the bible may have similar phenomenas, the magnitude of injections make it hard to prove every letter and the book as a whole as being from God, while Quran has only one number (the prime number 19, the Alpha 1, and the Omega 9) acting as the common deniminator of the WHOLE book (e.g: the number of chapters =19x6, the number of verses =19x334....etc), thus if only one letter is changed, the whole phenomena will vanish, this is not the case with the dispersed, unconnected phenomenas in the previous scriptures which were injected with Satan's idea of multiple gods.


3- A ship with one captain will reach a safe harbor. A family with one male captain will be a happy peacefull family...etc

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As for Jesus, he was just a human messenger same like Adam, Moses and Muhammad. The Jews persecuted him because he encouraged the people to stop worshiping and revering the Jewish priests instead of God, to stop following their inherited oral traditions (Mishnah, early Talmoud) instead of the word of God in the Torah alone. They saw him as a great threat to their rule, and soon conspired to kill him but God saved him and raised his soul before they tortured and crucified the empty body (the patients of Coma show similar symptoms of an empty, soulless body, yet fully awake).

Satan took it from there and using his agents started mysifying the dead Jesus and turning him into a god using his method of fear (trauma based mind control).




-Jesus was a creature created by God, just a human postman, in his own words:

``...I have not come of myself. I was sent by One who has the right to send, and him you do not know. I know him because it is from him I come; he sent me.'' [ John 7:28-29 ]


For those who like to twist these CLEAR words, and fuse the creature in his Craetor, they are only fooling themselves, and following conjecture.


``...Go to my brothers and tell them, `I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.' '' [ John 20:17 ]


A god will never say "i am ascending to my God" !

This is confirmed in the final scripture, Quran which gives us the most accurate account of Jesus:

Quran:

[3:49] As a messenger to the Children of Israel: "I come to you with a sign from your Lord - I create for you from clay the shape of a bird, then I blow into it, and it becomes a live bird by GOD's leave. I restore vision to the blind, heal the leprous, and I revive the dead by GOD's leave. I can tell you what you eat, and what you store in your homes. This should be a proof for you, if you are believers.

[3:50] "I confirm previous scripture - the Torah - and I revoke certain prohibitions imposed upon you. I come to you with sufficient proof from your Lord. Therefore, you shall observe GOD, and obey me.

[3:51] "GOD is my Lord and your Lord; you shall worship Him alone. This is the right path."

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If you have been thinking that Jesus is God, know that you have been duped by Satan, who wants people to worship the creatures instead of the One creator alone. Refrain from these blasphemies, for God's retribution promised for the idol-worshipers is severe, take a hint from the last tsunami before it's too late!

[5:116] GOD will say, "O Jesus, son of Mary, did you say to the people, `Make me and my mother idols beside GOD?' " He will say, "Be You glorified. I could not utter what was not right. Had I said it, You already would have known it. You know my thoughts, and I do not know Your thoughts. You know all the secrets.

[5:117] "I told them only what You commanded me to say, that: `You shall worship GOD, my Lord and your Lord.' I was a witness among them for as long as I lived with them. When You terminated my life on earth, You became the Watcher over them. You witness all things.
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[5:73] Pagans indeed are those who say that GOD is a third of a trinity. There is no god except the one god. Unless they refrain from saying this, those who disbelieve among them will incur a painful retribution.



http://www.usn2161.net/Christianity.html

lynns_shadow
01-01-2005, 03:00 PM
1 John 4:3

And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world. KJV

lynns_shadow
01-01-2005, 03:02 PM
1 John 4:3

and every spirit that confesseth not Jesus is not of God: and this is the 'spirit' of the antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it cometh; and now it is in the world already. ASV

Ahmad
01-02-2005, 04:18 AM
Peace,

I can see some patterns in misinterpreting the Gospel, e.g: relating verses said by God to Jesus instead, also reading with a premindset in favor of Jesus as the focus of the text, while God is the ONLY focus of it.

The late messenger of the covenant Rashad Khalifa (prophesized in Malachi 3:1-3)once said that almost 90% of the Gospel is true and from God, however Satan stresses on the 10% injections (which greatly contradict with the rest of the bible) to dupe the people into idolizing the prophet Jesus (the vehicle of the message) instead of worshiping God alone.

For example Jesus is consistently called "son of man" which conforms with the Quranic title (Son of Mary), but Satan injected the "son of God" to attach a divinity to Jesus.

Satan's ultimate goal on earth is to drive us all away from the Creator into worshiping the creatures.
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John 1 (New International Version)

1Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world. 2This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is FROM GOD, 3but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world.


As i said if you start reading with a mindset (Jesus is god) you will misunderstand the CLEAR passage.

The above simply say that anyone who rejects God's messengers is rejecting God, because they carry a message from God, so not believing them only means disbelief in God.

The following verses from the final testament, Quran points to three things, first that the crucifixion was used by Satan to induce a "Trauma based mind-control", and that God saved him before the crucifixion (raised his soul and left an empty non responsive body), and most importantly in verse 159 below God says what conforms with the above verse from John1, that EVERYONE among the Jews were required to believe in him, yet the majority didn't to this day.


[4:157] And for claiming that they killed the Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, the messenger of GOD. In fact, they never killed him, they never crucified him - they were made to think that they did. All factions who are disputing in this matter are full of doubt concerning this issue. They possess no knowledge; they only conjecture. For certain, they never killed him.

[4:158] Instead, GOD raised him to Him; GOD is Dignified,Wise.

[4:159] Everyone among the people of the scripture was required to believe in him before his death. On the Day of Resurrection, he will be a witness against them.

[4:160] Due to their transgressions, we prohibited for the Jews good foods that used to be lawful for them; also for consistently repelling from the path of GOD.


[4:161] And for practicing usury, which was forbidden, and for consuming the people's money illicitly. We have prepared for the disbelievers among them painful retribution.

[4:162] As for those among them who are well founded in knowledge, and the believers, they believe in what was revealed to you, and in what was revealed before you. They are observers of the Contact Prayers (Salat), and givers of the obligatory charity (Zakat); they are believers in GOD and the Last Day. We grant these a great recompense.


Ahmad Nishitoba

lynns_shadow
01-02-2005, 07:38 AM
Ahmad

First of all you keep insisting on using your bible, the Muslim Quuran, to talk about a God who is not your own God.

I think most who are insightful enough to know better, will not take advice about the "real Jesus" or truth about Him from a Muslim man. Everytime you post on here about God and then God relating to Jesus, you ultimately end up making your own blend of faith, combining, at your own will, words from your bible and our Bible and then a lot of lies about Jesus who is God alone.

The next time you talk about my LORD, I encourage you to say, "This is mine, Ahmad's opinion about Jesus". Because, unless you have had a redemptive experience in your life, where you can call Jesus Christ your Saviour and Lord, you are not going to have anything legitimite or credible to say about Christ in a deep or meaningful way. And, even if you were new to the faith and a baby Christian, at least you would know and understand Jesus Christ as God and part of the triune Godhead.

Everytime you come on here trying to promote the new world order's faith (one world one "god", without true redemption in Jesus Christ alone), you are in serious danger of having your lies throw off men and women coming here from knowing and understanding about the true God/Jesus Christ.

God's Word says you will be accountable for this, and that teachers who give false teaching, it would be better for them that a milestone had been hung around their necks, and that they fell to the bottom of the sea.

I see what you do here Ahmad, constantly lying about God the Father AND Jesus AND the Bible, then placing titles out there like: "the truth about Jesus" etc. As if you would know a thing about that as a Muslim man sharing nontruths/lies about my Lord.

What you are doing is deceitful, dishonest and a shame. I will write this because I care enough about the souls here to not see you keep writing and call you on it, if I can, when I can, when you do.

God's Word says :"Do you think the One who made the eyes cannot see, the One who made the ears cannot hear?"

You are in for trouble Ahmad, not just to the peril of your soul, but the dire occurances that wait you through God's wrath by purposefully seeking to turn souls from the Truth, Christ Jesus. Thus depriving them of the Truth to save bless and protect them in this life and the one to come.

freeman
01-02-2005, 07:56 AM
Everytime you come on here trying to promote the new world order's faith (one world one "god", without true redemption in Jesus Christ alone), you are in serious danger of having your lies throw off men and women coming here from knowing and understanding about the true God/Jesus Christ.

Based on the response I have noted to these topics, I don't see that happening, i. e., no significant number of converts being proselytized in Ahmad's direction, but I concur with your observation.
This seems like a really anal sticking point of dogma, i. e., whether Jesus or Muhammad should be worshipped along with God or simply revered as servants of the Almighty. A wedge issue, the specialty of the NWO -- and the basis for most recent political campaigns.
If one is to deconstruct this entire idol worship issue, it can devolve through endless levels. For instance, the Ark of the Covenant was not supposed to be a form of idol worship, even though it is revered as one of the great religious icons of all time.
Are temples, mosques, churches really necessry, or do they become idolatrous distractions at times? Botton line, if you look to closely at anything, you can see only its defects and lose sight of its true beauty and purpose. And that in itself is a distraction that borders on addiction which borders on idol worship.

lynns_shadow
01-02-2005, 08:17 AM
This seems like a really anal sticking point of dogma, i. e., whether Jesus or Muhammad should be worshipped along with God or simply revered as servants of the Almighty. A wedge issue, the specialty of the NWO -- and the basis for most recent political campaigns.

Freeman thank you, no one likes to be "anal" or feel they are talking that way. But the truth remains, Jesus Christ is a significant difference from Muhammad..One is God (Jesus) and one is not.

It means the very difference of the souls of men. The faith's direction determines Heaven or Hell and their life upon this earth.

As for the NWO I don't really give a hoot about their dialectics or techniques or wishes to "divide faiths", Christ came to divide, by bringing a sword to divide light and darkness.He told us men would not like this who do not know Him or who are blind to Him spiritually.

No one is interested in arguing for arguings sake.. I don't like arguing for non arguings sake..The point is the man is coming here daily and his words grossly misrepresent my Lord, the truth about Him and the truth about the salvation of men's souls.

I wish it were just some "anal" thing and I could say it's "my" issue but it's not..It is God's issue, but it becomes mine, in part, when I become His child and am held in part responsible, as best I can, to lead people to truth.

The choice between Jesus Christ and (any other 'god') is the choice between life and death, literally and figuratively.

To me it is that important the choice men make. As I'm sure it is for you.

nomad
01-02-2005, 10:23 AM
freeman wrote:
Everytime you come on here trying to promote the new world order's faith (one world one "god", without true redemption in Jesus Christ alone), you are in serious danger of having your lies throw off men and women coming here from knowing and understanding about the true God/Jesus Christ.

Based on the response I have noted to these topics, I don't see that happening, i. e., no significant number of converts being proselytized in Ahmad's direction, but I concur with your observation.
This seems like a really anal sticking point of dogma, i. e., whether Jesus or Muhammad should be worshipped along with God or simply revered as servants of the Almighty. A wedge issue, the specialty of the NWO -- and the basis for most recent political campaigns.
If one is to deconstruct this entire idol worship issue, it can devolve through endless levels. For instance, the Ark of the Covenant was not supposed to be a form of idol worship, even though it is revered as one of the great religious icons of all time.
Are temples, mosques, churches really necessry, or do they become idolatrous distractions at times? Botton line, if you look to closely at anything, you can see only its defects and lose sight of its true beauty and purpose. And that in itself is a distraction that borders on addiction which borders on idol worship.


I think the next big "battle" will be between

Mohammed and Jesus ... personally I don't think

The Koran has a chance in the long run ... just

looked at the successful prosperous countries

that are Muslim.

Ahmad
01-02-2005, 12:27 PM
I seek refuge in God from Satan, the rejected
In the name of God, The Gracious, The Merciful



[10:35] Say, "Does any of your idols guide to the truth?" Say, "GOD guides to the truth. Is one who guides to the truth more worthy of being followed, or one who does not guide, and needs guidance for himself? What is wrong with your judgment?"

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Lynne,

Personally i don't like to fight, it's not about me or my opinion, it's about THE TRUTH.

You call the truth "Lie, deceipt, false teaching", moreover you call God's religion " a satanic new world order" religion, therefore i cannot disregard this attack, but i can certainly disregard you.

The "Jesus" you are worshiping is Satan himself, you don't know the least about the real Jesus, who is an honorable prophet of God.

You are the one who is following the NWO's religion, i am sorry to say that but it's the truth, plain and simple. The NWO or Satan's religion is about "IDOL_WORSHIP", he and his agents adorn everything else than God (things and people) in our eyes to distract us from the real ONE god, who is the real Lord and only Savior.

So Satan will begin with adorning something or someone in your mind, same like he did before when he adorned the forbidden tree for Adam and his wife, he will tell you that the tree (money, celebrity, Jesus, Muhammad...etc) has a power (skill, knowledge, beauty, ..etc) which is independent of God, and then he promises you that this power would be yours, the next thing you know (if you accept his invitation) is your being totally stuck, glued to the thing or person unable to break free! thus the thing or person becomes an END in it or his or herself, a false god.

When that happens you become bound in slavery by Satan, the visible thing or person is but a tool in his hand to keep you checked inside the spiritual prison. Then you keep revolving in an orbit around your idol, completely distracted from God, righteousness and the truth.

Being family-centered, spouse-centered, celebrity-centered, women/men-centered, Jesus-centered or money-centered,status-centered, luxory-centered, interenet, synagogue, mosque or church-centered IS SATAN's NWO RELIGION.

Some may wonder, should we abandon everything and everyone then to be GOD-centered!? the answer is NO, the early Christians fell in that extreme (Hermitism), they even prohibited marriage.

[52:27] Subsequent to them, we sent our messengers. We sent Jesus the son of Mary, and we gave him the Injeel (Gospel), and we placed in the hearts of his followers kindness and mercy. But they invented hermitism which we never decreed for them. All we asked them to do was to uphold the commandments approved by GOD. But they did not uphold the message as they should have. Consequently, we gave those who believed among them their recompense, while many of them were wicked.

What "Submission" is all about is simply to SEE THROUGH things and people, and start RELATING all the powers in the world (beauty, skills, knowledge...etc) to the Creator, God instead of the visible creatures (which are an illusion), the creatures themselves have no inherent powers in them, Jesus wouldn't have uttered one word of wisdom without God inspiring him of it, he wouldn't have done any miracle without God's power.

Once you BELIEVE that there is actually nothing and nobody but God, you will lose your fear, worry, obsession and addictions.

You will be appreciative towards the Creator of all things alone, the Initiator of the heavens and the earth, you will be a balanced free individual as God originally created you.

Deuteronomy [6:5] Love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength.

This is what Satan and his agents hate the most, they hate that anybody would be FREE, they want to enslave everybody, it doesn't matter through whom or what, they use everything and everyone, whether Jesus, Mary, Muhammad or the saints, it makes no difference, their only goal is to distract you from God, your Creator, who has no equal.

Quran [18:102] Do those who disbelieve think that they can get away with setting up My servants as gods beside Me? We have prepared for the disbelievers Hell as an eternal abode.


This is my path, i invite to God alone, on the basis of a clear proof, and so do those who follow me. God be glorified. I am not an idol worshiper.


Ahmad Nishitoba

madkhao
01-02-2005, 06:33 PM
We have prepared for the disbelievers Hell as an eternal abode.


I know someone else asked you this already but I can't remember if you answered it. Who is WE?? in the quote above?

Ahmad
01-02-2005, 07:13 PM
Appendix 10 of the "Authorized english translation of Quran" by the messenger of the covenant Rashad Khalifa Ph.D:

God's Usage of the Plural Tense

In the English speaking world, where the trinity doctrine is prevalent, some people are intrigued by God's usage of the plural tense in the Quran. The overwhelming message of the Quran, where there is absolutely no compromise is that "GOD IS ONE" (2:133, 163; 4:171 5:73; 6:19; 9:31; 12:39; 13:16; 14:48, 52; 16:22, 51; 18:110; 21:108; 22:34; 37:4; 38:65; 39:4; 40:16; 41:6; 112:1).

Whenever the first person plural form is used by the Almighty, it invariably indicates participation of other entities, such as the angels. For example, the revelation of this Quran involved participation of the angel Gabriel and the prophet Muhammad. Hence the use of the plural form in 15:9:
"We revealed this scripture, and we will preserve it." The plural form here simply reflects the fact that the angel Gabriel and the prophet Muhammad participated in the processof delivering the Quran.

Another example has to do with blowing the breath of life into Adam and Jesus. The creation of Adam took place in heaven and God directly blew into him the breath of life. Thus, the first person singular form is consistently used: "I blew into Adam from My spirit" (15:29, 38:72).
The creation of Jesus, on the other hand, took place on earth,and Gabriel carried God's "word" to Mary. The plural form is consistently used when referring to the creation of Jesus (21:91, 66:12).

When God spoke to Moses directly, without the mediation of angels, we see that God is speaking exclusively in the singular tense:
"I am God. There is no other god besides Me. You shall worship Me alone, and
observe the regular contact prayers (Salat) to commemorate Me." (20:12-14).

Whenever the worship of God is mentioned, the singular tense is used (51:56).

sablefish
01-02-2005, 08:11 PM
I don't know about all that stuff, Ahmad.. What if I believe that evolutionary processes shaped this planet and Adam and Eve are symbols for things that people in the dark ages didn't, or couldn't understand?..

Why am I being fed a diet of things that go against the grain of reason and science?.. In case you didn't notice, science has managed to put sensing units beyond the solar system.. What are we supposed to believe.. A bunch of what looks like to me to be myths.. and abandon the sciences that have extended our lives threefold in the last millennia?..

I know you have a song to sing about some guy who claims to have figured out how the Universe works according to the numerological systems of 9's, and 1's..

While you are studying this very profound subject.. scientists are creating life in test tubes.. And it it's beginning to look like mankind and all living creatures are biomechanical.. And perhaps this world is a computer simulation, as science discovers the 11th dimension.. Thru quantum physics.. and if you don't believe in quantum theory.. You are wrong ..because it exists, and the proof is in the laser scanners at the grocery store.

Come out of the Age of Ignorance, and start reading stuff that is proven... and works, time after time.. Even though it is just a theory.. And that is what slays me.

People who think that just because it is a "Theory" it is not proof.. If you understood what science is you would realize that, every time we learn something we add to the knowledge base..

Fact and truth are relative to the times we live in and the methods, and systems we use to define our existence.. Copernicus, and Galileo were killed for stating what are the excepted beliefs of today.

Oh, I give up.. All I will will hear is a bunch of Dogma, and people yelling, telling me that the world is flat and that the Sun goes around the Earth, because they read it in some Big Black Book.

Forgive me while I barf.

Ahmad
01-02-2005, 08:36 PM
Many people here think that i am a "Muslim", while i said it more than once that i follow "Submission" the religion named by your father Abraham.

The Muslim clergy have all these nonsensical claims you mention, the highest Saudi religious authority "Abdul Azeez Bin Baaz" (President of the Islamic University of Medina, Saudi Aarabia) declared in 1975 that the earth is flat and standing still!!, what was his basis? the satanic books of Hadith.

As for Quran it conforms with logic and science, there are no mysteries or secrets, all is crystal clear.

The earth ROTATES in Quran,

[27:88] When you look at the mountains, you think that they are standing still. But they are moving, like the clouds. Such is the manufacture of GOD, who perfected everything. He is fully Cognizant of everything you do.

The BIG BANG was designed by God,

[21:30] Do the unbelievers not realize that the heaven and the earth used to be one solid mass that we exploded into existence? And from water we made all living things. Would they believe?

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I know how Satan drives people away from God, by pushing them into extreme perceptions of the message of God. Some may say that Quran is too complicated to understand (as the Muslim did, and thus turned to the Hadith books) and some would say it's too illogical, unscientifical and ignorant, however this is FAR from the truth. I believe everybody deep inside knows the truth from falsehood, however the majority choose to ignore the call of their hearts, Satan gives them excuses to help them out!, do not be shortcircuited like the majority, you are smarter than that.

sablefish
01-02-2005, 10:11 PM
Cool.. Ahmad.. I was expecting you to yell.. I enjoyed your response...

By the Way.. I believe Submission is the Mother of all religion.. It is in Christian practice the belief that all we need to do is ask in our prayers.. That it be in Heaven as it is on Earth and submit ourselves to our destiny..

Who are we to pray for things that we have no knowledge of?

Are we to ask God for things at all, or accept that our prayers for things and events are just vanity, that might get in the way of a plan that we cannot conceive?.

Submission is the Mother of Faith and the center of higher truth...Because we will never know what we did for the greater Glory of God... If our Prayers were only that we walk in path of The Devine guiding light, God's will well be done.

Peace brother. (I don't know about all this 9 and 1 stuff).. But perhaps there is a relationship.. I just can't see it now.. O.K.

nomad
01-03-2005, 01:51 AM
Submission to the true God I agree 100%.

Submission to a religion that tells you

72 virgins are waiting for you after you

die as a reward. You have got to be retarded.

(with all due respect)

marypopinz
01-03-2005, 02:14 AM
nomad, thanx for the giggles

lolololol

XXX

Ahmad
01-03-2005, 09:33 AM
Peace Nomad


"Submission to the true God I agree 100%.

Submission to a religion that tells you

72 virgins are waiting for you after you

die as a reward. You have got to be retarded."



I agree with you 200%, the majority of muslims now are retarded. I don't know if you have missed my first posts here or what, but i don't follow the so called "Islam", it's as corrupt as Christianity.

The 72 virgins you mention are found in the Hadith satanic books , as for Quran it gives an allegorical description of Heaven, as in our limited minds we cannot comprehend the real heaven or hell, thus all the talk about pure spouses, gardens with flowing streams, fire and hellish drinks are only to deliver an emotional impact, not directed to our bodily instincts!

ephesians6
01-03-2005, 11:01 PM
Ahmad, no follower of Christ will be influenced by you because the Holy Spirit and the Word are stronger than your attempts to spread your deceptive dogma. (If you want to deceive the deceived into gobbling up your odd beliefs, why not try an American college campus? There you'll find scores of lost and confused imbeciles who might just believe you.)

Just what sect of Islam are you a part of? Sunni, Shia, Sufi?

I've never heard of any Muslim rejecting the Hadith, the alleged words of Mohammed.

In addition, what mosque do you attend and who is your iman?

Rarely do proselytizing Muslims ever want to answer those questions, which speaks volumes about their intentions.

Ahmad
01-05-2005, 09:41 AM
My sect is, "Strict Monotheism", the creed of Abraham, Submission to God alone.

My mosque is God's spacious earth.

And my imam is God alone.



Ahmad Nishitoba

nomad
01-05-2005, 01:33 PM
Ahmad, is God love to you ?

Ahmad
01-06-2005, 12:58 AM
Peace Nomad,


For me God is more than love. God is the one who created me from scratch, the one who supports every second of my existence. Without His support i would just vanish.
So God is all, God is love, justice, freedom, mercy. He is also the Almighty, the Avenger.

nomad
01-06-2005, 07:25 AM
Say Jesus is not God as Christians claim.

How is that as a mere human, Jesus was able to

express and believe (even if false) an idea

of love greater than God himself in any religion

ever has ... and that is the idea of God

choosing to die to save his creation ... much

like a mother would choose to die in order

to save her baby ?

Isn't it curious that Jesus had a better

idea of love than God himself ?

Akbar
01-06-2005, 07:54 AM
When we talk about the truth of Jesus we cannot over look the fact that there is a lot of sinning going on in the world. So no one has died for the sins of the world. This idea is two sided. Yes, it has healing power which is that there has now come one who has died for your sins, so you do not have to worry if you accept him you will have a new life like a new born baby. So yes if a person accepts that belief and stops sinning then it can heal. The flip side of it is that it gives the ignorant a license to commit all types of sins because their logic is why should I worry about sinning if someone has died for my sins. In predominantly Christian countries you see more moral sins than any other place in the world. So this belief has had more of a negative affect on them. By comparing Jesus to God is not doing a favor to Jesus. When I read the Bible Jesus is in constant worship of God through prayer, fasting, and living his life as God's servant. In fact the people who seem to follow Jesus most based on how he lived his life in the Bible are Muslims. Jesus never walked on the earth comparing himself to God or connecting himself to God. That was done by man to enslave man, they wanted to take the worhip away from God. So the Bible asked will a man rob God? It is referring to man taking the worship that is only do to God away and worshipping something else. When we evolve to our God consciousness we will be blessed to see Jesus as nothing more than a humble servant of Allah.

nomad
01-06-2005, 09:35 AM
All logical except that true Christians have

one problem with all that.

------------------------------------------
JOHN 20:22 NKJ
22 And when He had said this, He breathed on them, and said to them, "Receive the Holy Spirit."
------------------------------------------


This quote will NEVER make sense to non

believers. To believers its one of the most

puzzlingly enigma.

1. If Jesus was not God how did he know there

was even such a thing as a Holy Spirit ?

2. How did he know that HE was able to make

a believer receive it ?

Unfortunately only believers will understand what

I am saying ... and that creates the big divide.

billiard
01-06-2005, 10:26 AM
ahmad

it is obvious and admirable that you believe what you believe so strongly as to depart from the vast majority of those who believe in quran . that takes guts . and you are obviously a very intelligent man ,no doubt multi-lingual and your posts are well-expressed . but you , like the rest of us , are on a journey through life . you have certain information imparted to you while a child .as you grow older ,you aquire new information and begin to consider how ,or if, it all fits consistently and neatly together .then you begin to question things and as more new information comes(thank God for the internet!)you reject some things as you try to make sense of the world you were born into . we're really all in the same situation ,it's just that some of us started out with different information and thus, are at a different place in our journey . when you come to the point of saying "ok now i have the truth on this" you are in danger of running off the road into a ditch . you are still on your journey, you haven't reached a destination yet .

i commend you on seeing ,identifying and rejecting the errors of islam . it shows independence of thought . simply consider the possibility that there is more truth that you have not yet discovered . you may not have the truth about jesus , but my bet is if you keep your eyes open on your journey ,eventually you will .

nomad
01-06-2005, 10:49 AM
Ahmad,

Let me try to put it this way with Jesus

and the "Holy Spirit".

Say I said to you that the moment I snap

my fingers you WILL get a high, as if you

get took some drugs ... and lo and behold

I snap my fingers and boom you get a "high"

exactly as I said.

What would you say if this was possible ?

billiard
01-06-2005, 11:04 AM
nomad what in the world are you talking about ?

madkhao
01-06-2005, 11:22 AM
What a beautiful thread.
I was in a trance.
Words were written so peacefully.
Then nomad snapped his fingers
And I cracked up

billiard
01-06-2005, 12:29 PM
ha ha ha .
now i'm crackin up too . g1 mad cow

Akbar
01-06-2005, 02:40 PM
JOHN 20:22 NKJ
22 And when He had said this, He breathed on them, and said to them, "Receive the Holy Spirit."

It's easy to take any verse out of revelations and twist it to fit your own meaning. When we add the verse before it. It has an entire different meaning.

21] Jesus said to them again, "Peace be with you. As the Father has sent me, even so I send you."
[22] And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and said to them, "Receive the Holy Spirit.
[23] If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained.

Allah sent his word (Jesus) to mankind to resurrect mankind with life (breath), it is only through the word (Jesus) of God that mankind can receive the Holy Spirit. Verse 23, rules out the idea that Jesus died for anyone's sin. It is very symbolic, but the logic is if Jesus died for your sins then there shouldn't be any for you to forgive or retain. When a revelation from God does not make sense to your rational mind, then you have to assume that it is symbolic. God does not give you a human brain then turns around an insult your intelligence by saying just believe even if your brain says otherwise.

The Bible is a very symbolic book. It is designed to send the ignorant into Lala land. If you do not understand the symbolism behind it you are lost. I know some of the ones who are in the top level of secret organizations laugh when I say this because they know it is true. They hide the knowledge and the servants of God reveals the knowledge to all mankind. Jesus states in the Bible that he speaks in parables. The intelligent person would understand that you cannot take what Jesus said literally after he just told you he speaks in parables.

The argument is over according to the world. In the West secularism has Christianity on the ropes. There are not many good moral examples in the West. When people want to improve their morals they usually had east, and when they want to make money they had west. when we begin to see Jesus in his proper light, then the message has a more uplifting effect that is universal. Jesus was only a sign pointing man to worship the one true God. So the ignorant Christian will say the only way to salvation is to accept Jesus as your only lord and savior. The actual intrepretation of this symbolic saying is that When you incorporate the word (Jesus) of God in your life, then you would be saved.

peace

nomad
01-06-2005, 03:05 PM
billiard wrote:
nomad what in the world are you talking about ?

LOL exactly my point ... only someone who

has spoken in tongues would understand this

... don't ask me to explain speaking in tongues !

:-D

let's get back to the NWO !

billiard
01-06-2005, 09:47 PM
nomad maybe i have spoken in tongues but it wasn't like taking drugs(maybe i've done that too) are you trying to tell me you can't explain it or that you'd rather not?

Ahmad
01-07-2005, 02:15 AM
Peace Billiard,

"when you come to the point of saying "ok now i have the truth on this" you are in danger of running off the road into a ditch . you are still on your journey, you haven't reached a destination yet ."


The truth is and was always there, it is not a mystery that everybody is looking for. The truth is there in Quran for those who have eyes to see. As for me i strive to stay on THAT straight path which we already have knowledge about!

If i have reached my destinatiuon already, i would be in Heaven now!

Jesus is not a god, that's one truth that cannot be compromised. The holy spirit is the messenger/angel Gabriel who delivered God's inspiration to Jesus as well as all the righteous.

Clear and simple, why do you want a complicated truth?


Ahmad Nishitoba

nomad
01-07-2005, 07:25 AM
billiard wrote:
nomad maybe i have spoken in tongues but it wasn't like taking drugs(maybe i've done that too) are you trying to tell me you can't explain it or that you'd rather not?

Don't mind talking about "speaking in tongues"

but for people who have never experienced it you

come across as a crazy ... those who experienced

it know its real. The conspiracy in all this is

again

1.How did Jesus KNOW there was such a thing ?

2.How did he know HE can give it to others ?

nomad
01-07-2005, 07:29 AM
Quote from Ahmad,
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Clear and simple, why do you want a complicated truth?
----------------------------------------------


Ahmad say you are God.

You want to give your creation a message

that can't be misinterpreted nor corrupted.

How would you do it ?