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JBoy
11-08-2010, 07:17 AM
cont,


November 15 1995, Steven Brian Alvarado v. State of Texas, 912 S.W.2d 199, Convictions and death sentence affirmed.

Overview: Alvarado killed two people, a mother and son, during a drug deal. A year or so prior to the murder Alvarado had been in the hospital. The psychologist stated he was considered "violent and dangerous and that he had a full-blown antisocial personality disorder."... he had "no concern for the rights of others, and that he admitted selling illegal weapons, abusing and selling illegal drugs, sexually assaulting a woman, mutilating human infants in satanic rituals, and committing numerous other crimes. He was discharged after twelve days in the hospital because he was felt to be a danger to the other patients and that he was not suffering from a mental illness that was treatable, and, therefore under the mental health code had to be discharged."
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August 1995, Edward Bennett v. State of Nevada, 901 P.2d 676, Murder conviction affirmed.

Overview: Bennett was sentenced to death for killing a girl. Writings were seized showing that the murder was "ritualistic and satanic." Some of these statements included: "There's a problem in this country and has a lot to do with being white. There's too many people with ugly skin."... "I need to kill somebody or tear someone apart. I got to satisfy my need, cure this thirst for blood. So as I make the sacrifice by doing it just for you and kill this child, for it is a first born, I'm giving you my soul, Satan. Where is my reward? My thirst for blood is now calm, but it shall rise again. My power is so strong I need to cause some death. For Lucifer's inside of me, and I don't want to let him out. I look in the mirror, I see him in my eyes. I feel his heart beating in my chest, and I know it is not mine. For I feel so privileged for I'm with number one. I'm so f_____powerful and my reigning has just begun as I kill and kill again. I feel my rewards come on. My power's growing even greater. I'm so f___ strong for I am the devil's right-hand man. I carry out his every chore. I make this sacrifice in his name, Lucifer the Great, blood splattered on my face from the kill I've just done.
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July 1995, STATE OF NORTH CAROLINA v. MICHAEL ALAN PARKER, SR. NO. COA94-1045 COURT OF APPEALS OF NORTH CAROLINA 119 N.C. App. 328; 459 S.E.2d 9; 1995 N.C. App. LEXIS 523 July 5, 1995, Filed. Convictions for multiple counts of child molestation affirmed.

Overview: The defendant thought there should be a mistrial for several reasons, one of which was witness testimony that he threatened to bomb the woman's shelter his wife and family were staying at. Appeals court describes children testimony: "... Defendant pulled down S's pants and threw her on the floor and inserted a spoon into her vagina and moved it around. Defendant took blood that was on the spoon, put it in a cup and drank it while the others were standing around singing with lit candles."..."S testified that when defendant took her to the woods behind her grandmother's house and abused her in front of several people holding lit candles, another young girl, A Robinson, "started screaming at first and then she jumped up and she had no clothes on and she started running and her dad jumped up and started chasing after her through the woods." One of the children also described molest by the grandmother. In news articles she's named as the co-defendant. A news article relates that the children testified that Parker raped and sodomized them in the family's trailer near Saluda and in nearby woods, often while other people wearing black pants and white shirts stood around chanting. See, "Dad guilty of Abusing children Sexually, Eight Life Sentences" Greensboro News & Record, Feb. 6, 1994
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June 1995, Athens, Greece; Satanic Cult leader Asimakis Katsoulas and Manos Dimitrokallis were found guilty of kidnapping, raping and murdering a 30 year old woman and a 15 year old girl during occult ceremonies. They were sentenced to life imprisonment. Dimitra Maryetti was found guilty of complicity and sentenced to 23 years.

Overview: Katsoulas and his "high priestess" confessed to leading a 20 member satanic cult, which had conducted animal and human sacrifices for three years. The first victim was killed at her initiation ceremony. Katsoulas claimed he was the vehicle for "ancient demons." Another witness was abducted when the murderers told her they were police officers who wanted to question her. See, "Two young men confess to Rape, Murder of two women as part of a satanic cult ritual, police said"; AP, Dec. 28, 1993 and "Court convicts, sentences two to life terms for murder", AP, June 30, 1995.
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December 1994, IN THE MATTER OF: Heather BARKER, NEGLECTED CHILD, COURT OF APPEALS OF OHIO, Case No. 441 SEVENTH APPELLATE DISTRICT, HARRISON COUNTY, LEXIS 6100, Juvenile Court Decision to Grant Permanent Custody to DHS Affirmed

Overview: At the age of 5, Heather was taken into custody by DHS due to physical injuries to her genital area. Cumulative testimony proved to the court that she'd been sexually molested by clear and convincing evidence, although there wasn't any obvious perpetrator to hold accountable. The mother was cited for neglect and was given 18 months reunification services but they did not alleviate the problems which brought the child into custody. Social Services didn't think the mother could protect the child. The child was prone to "trance-like" states after unsupervised visits with the mother and other unusual behavior. A treating psychologist and social worker thought the child had been ritually sexually abused based on her statements. A trial took place contesting these matters and the court amended the abuse complaint, based on clear and convincing evidence, to a finding of neglect as well.
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April 1994, In Re: Chrystal and Tasha, Superior Court of Connecticut, Juvenile Matters, Lexis 1061. Termination of Parental Rights Affirmed

Overview: Appellate opinion cites that these children were in several placements over a period of 4 years after a finding of neglect in juvenile court. The mother was in and out of prison due to drug usage and sales. One of the children had been diagnosed with multiple personality disorder and had been subjected to Satanism. It was not clear whether the incidents took place with the biological mother or in the foster homes the child was in over the years where allegations of abuse had been confirmed. Further exploration revealed that the child connected terrifying experiences in a ritualistic, abusive church and sexual abuse with her biological mother. Contact with her mother was suspended when the child began exhibiting negative behaviors after visitations or after other types of communication.
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March 1994, State of North Carolina v. Patrick S. Figured, 446 S.E.2d 838, Convictions affirmed for first-degree sexual offenses involving 3 children.

Overview: Figured had entered an Alford Plea of guilty to all three charges. The state agreed to dismiss charges against his girlfriend, Sonja Hill. The DA reindicted Sonja Hill and on April 15, 1991 wanted his guilty plea set aside on the grounds the DA had violated the agreement. The motion was granted. On March 9 1992, a grand jury re-indicted Figured and he was convicted of all charges. A news article reports that parents of two of these victims filed a civil suit against Sonja Hill and her mother who ran the daycare center. The parents alleged that their children had been forced to participate in Satan worship while being abused. The kids spoke of having to drink blood, their abusers burned Bibles and wore masks and capes. Hill and her mother did not answered the lawsuit, and a Johnston County jury awarded a $10.5 million judgment to the parents who didn't believe they'd ever collect the money but wanted other people to know that these acts do occur. See, "Johnston couple win child sex abuse suit" News and Observer, Mar 27, 1990
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Dec. 1993, Washington D.C, United States. On December 27, 1993, U.S. News and World Report cited that the Justice Dept. was reinvestigating the "Finders case."

The news article mentions that some of the unresolved questions are allegations that the Finders Group are linked to the Central Intelligence Agency and whether or not the investigation into their activity had been closed inappropriately.

Overview: "The many unanswered questions about the Finders case now have Democratic Rep. Charlie Rose of North Carolina, Chairman of the House Administration committee, and Florida's Rep. Tom Lewis, a Republican, more than a little exercised. "Could our own government have something to do with this Finders organization and turned their backs on these children? That's what all the evidence points to," says Lewis, and there's a lot of evidence."... "Law enforcement sources say some of the Finders are listed in the FBI's classified counterintelligence files."

As background, in early Feb. 1987 six children were taken into custody in Tallahassee, Florida. Two men were charged with child abuse, but charges were dropped. The men said the children were "transporting these children to Mexico and a school for brilliant children" Their mothers were located in a group called the Finders. At the same time, Washington, D.C., police and U.S. Customs Service agents raided a duplex apartment building and a warehouse connected to the group. Customs Reports cite that among the evidence seized were detailed instructions on obtaining children for unknown purposes around the world, child trafficking, instructions to keep the above six children moving and how to avoid detection, several photographs of nude children that appeared to "accent" the child's genitals; photographs of children involved in animal rituals, an altar, jars of urine and feces, and a staging area, all of which appeared to the Custom's Agents as an "indoctrination" center. Custom's agents were told to drop their investigation because it had become a "CIA internal matter" and that is documented in their report.

"Officials of the U.S. Customs Service, called in to aid in the investigation, said that the material seized yesterday includes photos showing children involved in bloodletting ceremonies of animals and one photograph of a child in chains. Customs officials said they were looking into whether a child pornography operation was being conducted." See, "Officials Describe 'Cult Rituals' in Child Abuse Case", The Washington Post, Feb. 7, 1987 and, "Through a glass, very darkly: Cops, spies and a very odd investigation," U.S. News and World Report,
December 27, 1993/January 3, 1994
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November 1993, COMMONWEALTH OF PENNSYLVANIA v. RICKIE JAY GADDIS, Appellant NO. 00561 PITTSBURGH, 1993 SUPERIOR COURT OF PENNSYLVANIA 432 Pa. Super. 523; 639 A.2d 462; 1994 Pa. Super. LEXIS 963, Argued March 22, 1994

Overview: In the judges own words, "These consolidated appeals are taken from the judgments of sentence imposed on February 9, 1993. Appellant was found guilty in two separate trials of more than 150 counts of aggravated assault, 18 Pa.C.S. ¤ 2702; recklessly endangering another person, ¤ 2705; terroristic threats, ¤ 2706; endangering the welfare of children, ¤ 4304; corruption of minors, ¤ 6301; false imprisonment, ¤ 2903; simple assault, ¤ 2701; prohibited offensive weapons, ¤ 908; rape, ¤ 3121; statutory rape, ¤ 3122; involuntary deviate sexual intercourse, ¤ 3123; aggravated indecent assault, ¤ 3125; indecent exposure, ¤ 3127; incest, ¤ 4302; and criminal conspiracy, ¤ 903.

Overview: "These charges arose from the horrific sexual, physical and emotional abuse and neglect by appellant, Rickie Jay Gaddis, of his minor children." Gaddis was sentenced to 235 years (plus) in prison. The appellate court affirmed his sentence but vacated his fine. There had been concern he was going to capitalize on his crimes by selling a book. The police stated at the time that the children were subjected by their parents and neighbors to ritualistic torture that included bloodlettings with a sword, satanic ceremonies, hot needles under their fingernails, sodomy, stretching and tattooing. See, "Pa. couple is charged with torturing children; Police say neighbors also took part in abuse", The Atlanta Journal and Constitution, November 26, 1991; and "Pennsylvania Couple Charged With Brutalizing Their Children," The Washington Post, November 26, 1991: and "Parents charged with Torturing their Children", Associated Press, Nov. 25, 1991
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November 1992, Austin, Texas; People of Texas v. Frances and Daniel Keller, Case #924217, Convicted for aggravated sexual assault on a child; Sentenced to 48 years. Both cases upheld on appeal No. 3-92-603-CR, and No. 3-92-604-CR on Oct 26, 1994.

Overview: News articles chronicling the trial cited more than one child thought to be abused at "Fran's Day Care" in Austin, Texas, operated by the Keller's, but this particular case cites their conviction of only one child, while news reports say other charges with other children are pending. Tears were found in the child's vagina. Douglas Wayne Perry, the ex-husband of one of the two other alleged perpetrators who were former deputy constables, confessed that he, along with the constables and the Kellers, engaged in "beer and sex parties, during which several children were sexually assaulted by the adults while photographs were taken." He recanted his confession but then pleaded guilty to a charge of indecency with a child. He confessed to tearing a head off a doll and threatening the children that if they told, their heads would come off the same way. The children described ritual acts, being terrorized in a graveyard, seeing animals killed and bodies dug up and mutilated with a chainsaw.

A 6-yr-old child, who also claimed to be a victim, testified on the behalf of the 3 1/2 year old and called Fran's Day Care, "Fran's Hate Care." The defense lawyers used videos showing some the younger child recanting, saying the abuse never happened, to try to undermine the case. The parents claimed that one of the perpetrators was flashing threatening hand signals during the child's testimony. The defense also stated that the claims were "too outlandish to be believed" because the children also spoke of going on airplane rides and seeing a baby killed. A child led an investigator to a graveyard where they found animal bones. Parents of two children, who said they were abused, have filed a civil suit holding three people accountable (the three described above) for not reporting the abuse. Another mother said "I put my son in a mental hospital as a result of this abuse (by the Kellers), and it's only been through over a year of intensive psychotherapy that he's begun to partially heal." See, "6-yr-old testifies he witnessed abuse of girl", Nov. 24, 1992 , and "Kellers found guilty of sexual assault", Nov. 26, 1992, Austin American Statesman
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October 1992, Earnest v. State, Supreme Court of Georgia, 422 S.E.2d 188, Conviction for murder affirmed.

Overview: Earnest was convicted of malice murder. A self-described high priest of a satanic cult performed a satanic ritual over the female victim. Evidence of Satan worship and evidence of the cult's involvement in church vandalisms was admissible as evidence as to motive for the crime.
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September 1992, Eastland County, Texas. The STATE OF TEXAS VS. PHIL STANLEY ROGERS; Case No. 18, 738; Charged and pleaded guilty to "Indecency with a child, younger than 17 years, committed during the course of a ritual." Jury sentence - 99 years.

Overview: A news report [no date yet], cites that the rituals began with the purchase of a Ouija board. Items taken as evidence included books covering satanic topics, pentagram symbols, candles, daggers and wands.
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April 1992, In the Matter of the Welfare of J. M. P., C9-91 -1899, COURT OF APPEALS OF MINNESOTA, Lexis 436. Termination of Parental Rights Affirmed.

Overview: By the mother's own admission, her past included "years of sexual and physical abuse, parental neglect, early and long-standing addiction to numerous drugs, serious mental health problems, and involvement in a satanic cult." Her child was taken into custody after two hospitalizations due to overdosing. The mother was involved in four incidents, three involving criminal convictions, which caused harm to children, including J.M.P. The mother tried to commit suicide, and was diagnosed with borderline personality disorder.
March 1992, Orlando, Florida; Margie Wright pleaded no contest to three charges of attempted sexual battery and two charges of attempted lewd acts and was sentenced to 5 1/2 years in prison. Jim Wright was convicted of raping and fondling five children.

Overview: Three news articles describing the case cite that this couple were charged with molesting children in the context of satanic rituals. The parents of three of the victims moved residences and the prosecutor expressed concern because the children had been threatened by the cult not to testify. The victim's parents met the Wrights through their Church. The children reported that they saw Wright sacrifice a stray dog, slit its throat and stomach and remove some entrails. Sheriff's investigators found the dog's skeleton near the Wright's trailer. The Wright's molested children during their "Magic Show." The victims said he pulled a gun out of a hat and made their underwear disappear. They stated that Jim Wright put a "bad curse" on them and said "devil words." The children described satanic symbols, chalices filled with blood and a box containing a corpse. They had been told not to tell or their parents would be killed. Maggie Wright testified against her husband while she pleaded no contest to reduced charges. See, "Convict's Wife Sentenced for Trying to Molest Kids", Orlando Sentinel Tribune, May 9, 1992; "A Family Fears That Satanic Cult will try to Silence their Sons," Orlando Sentinel Tribune, August 10, 1991; "Child Abuse Suspect Trades
Testimony for Lesser Charges", Orlando Sentinel Tribune, January 31, 1992
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January 1992, THE STATE OF WASHINGTON V. Paul Ross Ingram, NO. 13613-9-II Division Two, Confession to sexual molestation and 20 yr. exceptional sentence affirmed.

Overview: Paul Ingram, former Thurston County chief civil deputy sheriff and 16-year law enforcement officer, was arrested November 28, 1988 following allegations of sexual abuse made by his daughters, then about 18 and 22 years old. Ingram waived his right to counsel and made incriminating statements. After six months of further investigation and interrogation, Ingram was charged by amended information with six counts of rape in the third degree, three counts per daughter covering July through October 1988. He tried to withdraw his guilty plea but that was denied.

Note: It's been widely reported (by the officer's involved) that Ingram also confessed to ritually abusing his children in the context of satanic ceremony, which his daughters also claimed took place. Richard Ofshe of the FMSF tried to talk Ingram out of his confession by claiming he confessed in a "trance-like" state and "proved" that by suggesting to Ingram a case scenario which very well could have happened. In reality, Ofshe's experiment was not proof of "false memories" or proof of a false confession, and the court rejected these claims. Both Ofshe and Elizabeth Loftus of the False Memory Syndrome Foundation also testified at Ingram's clemency hearing trying to help obtain his release. According to news articles and the Clemency Board Transcripts, Ingram's son also attended that particular hearing and asked the board to keep his father in prison, as did other members of the Ingram family, which the board did. See, "Felons hope for a parting gift from Lowry", Seattle Times, Dec. 12, 1996
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Feb 1992, San Francisco, California; Michael A. Aquino, Plaintiff-Appellant v. Michael P.W. Stone, Secretary of the Army, 957 F.2d 139, 768 F.Supp. 529 - Dismissal of lawsuit affirmed.

Overview: Michael Aquino, the founder of a Satanist group, Temple of Set, was a Lt. Col in the Army Active Reserves. After the Presidio Day Care case, he sued the Army after they "titled" him under an investigatory report for indecent acts with a child, sodomy, conspiracy, kidnapping, and false swearing, and for his dismissal from the active reserves. The documents state:

"Aquino contends that evidence collected by the Army CID did not justify its creating an investigation report titled under his name and that those involved with the investigation were motivated to remove him from the Army because he is the founder of the Temple of Set, a Satanist religion."

"Aquino filed suit in the district court under the Privacy Act, U.S.C 552a(g) to compel the Army to amend the investigatory report about him and for damages resulting from his discharge from the service, which he attributes to the inaccurate records about him.

"{1} In 1990 a continuation board of the Army Reserve recommended discontinuing Aquino's service in the Reserve, and he was processed out of the Army."

Aquino was never criminally charged and the Army released its report and titled him 3 months after the criminal statute of limitations ran. Aquino's lawsuit against the Army was dismissed.

Note: Aquino claims to have received a Meritorious Certificate from the Army in 1994.

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Sept. 1988, Santa Rosa, Calif; People v. Daryl T. Ball, Court No. 14750-C, Pleaded no contest to lewd and lascivious acts with 6 child victims.

Overview: The case involved brutal sexual assault of these children in the context of a "devil worship club." The two main culprits, Charlotte Thrailkill and Daryl Ball, were caught and sentenced to prison. The Criminal Investigative Division of the Army interviewed some of these same children in their "titling" investigation of Michael Aquino of the Temple of Set. (Case above). This case was described by the prosecutor as involving multi-victims/perpetrators and ritual abuse, although Ball and Thrailkill were the only ones charged. The prosecutor described the extreme terror the children experienced and the difficulty for them to testify. During the 18 month preliminary hearing, the children testified that they were threatened to keep quiet or the perpetrators would eat their mothers hearts and make them eat it. They described being given injections (or were bled), and being tied up. Daryl Ball threatened witnesses to keep them from testifying. The children also described being molested while being filmed with a banner in the background reading "Super Duper Child Molest Day." They were forced to watch the video of their own molest afterwards. A plea bargain was struck, reportedly to spare the kids from having to testify further.

**In Sept. 1998, Charlotte Thrailkill was declared a violent sexual molest predator--the first female to have that distinction in California. See, "Thrailkill a sexual predator, Ex-SR woman first in state with designation", Santa Rosa Press Democrat, Sept. 9, 1998
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July 1991, Commonwealth of Pennsylvania v. Jason L. Enders,
et al, 407 Pa. Superior Ct. 201, Conviction Affirmed.

Overview: Defendants were convicted of false imprisonment stemming from their participation in a Satanic cult ritual. Victim stated he wanted nothing to do with them but he was forcibly taken to an abandoned barn and tied to stakes in the ground over a pentagram drawn in the dirt. A satanic ritual was performed over him. He had a leather collar with nails placed around his neck. One of the defendants punctured his neck by pressing on the nails and placed his fingers in the victim's blood and then to his lips. He was released after being warned he'd be killed if he told anyone. The appellate court stated admitting evidence of belief in and involvement in Satanism at the time was relevant and probative. Skulls and books were taken from their homes as evidence.
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April 1991, Montana. State of Montana v. Leon Lloyd Whitcher, 810 P2d 751, Conviction Affirmed.

Overview: A 30 yr. old self-described "high priest" of a satanic cult had sexual intercourse with a 14 yr. old without consent. Prior to the assault, he asked her a series of questions about initiation into his satanic cult, whether she wanted "power," and if she'd "obey a high priest." He told her to change into a black robe, lie down, and stare at a pentagram painted on the ceiling before he assaulted her.
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March 1991, STATE MISSOURI v. THERON REED ROLAND COURT OF APPEALS OF MISSOURI, WESTERN DISTRICT, No. WD 40883, 808 S.W.2d 855, STATE OF MISSOURI, RESPONDENT, First degree murder conviction affirmed.

Overview: According to Roland, he murdered his friend after becoming involved in Satanism, began using drugs, and listening to groups like "Megadeth" that "advocated sexual and physical violence." He began hallucinating, practiced self-mutilation, tortured and killed animals and "chanted" to Satan for power. He developed a mentor relationship with another teen Satanist and they both decided to sacrifice Steve Newberry by clubbing him to death. Roland believed this human sacrifice would "cause Satan to appear and give them power." Roland wanted the defense expert on the occult to testify about the effects of Satanism on the mind. The court let the expert testify to other aspects of the occult but didn't feel that he was qualified to testify on psychiatric aspects of the case.
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Oct 89, People of the State of Illinois, v. Andrew Kokoraleis, No. 65229, Supreme Court of Illinois, 547 N.E.2d 202. Conviction for murder and death penalty affirmed.

Overview: Four members of a satanic cult, including Robin Gecht, were perpetrators in a series of gruesome murders, rituals, and acts of cannibalism over a number of years.

"Thomas Kokoraleis told investigators that the room had contained an altar, made from a board covered with red cloth, where cult members cut up animal parts, and sometimes human parts, for sacrifice. See, "GRUESOME CLUES LED TO AN ALTAR IN AN ATTIC", Chicago Tribune, October 12, 1987
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Dec. 17, 1990, Conviction for first degree murder perpetrated by torture affirmed; No. C-92-1523 EFL UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT FOR THE NORTHERN DISTRICT OF CALIFORNIA 1995 U.S. Dist. LEXIS 19425 - habeas petition denied; June 1985, San Francisco, Calif., People v. Cliff St. Joseph, 226 Cal. App. 3d 289,

Overview: A body was discovered in San Francisco, California on June 15, 1985. "John Doe" had multiple stab wounds, genital injuries, and a pentagram had been carved into his chest. The court notes that there was "substantial evidence" that it was a sadistic, ritualistic human sacrifice consisting of whipping with a chain, slashing the victim's lips, dripping wax into the victim's eyes, burning and carving the victim's flesh with a knife, multiple stabbings, tying the limbs with guitar wire, and genital mutilations. The identity of the victim was never established. The case was solved when the police arrested 4 people for disturbing the peace, one of whom was a Ricky Hunter. Hunter claimed St. Joseph and the others had held him against his will and assaulted him; there was talk of satanic worship and the other three people had been speaking of "sacrificing" him. One of the offenders stated he had been present when St. Joseph had "John Doe" in his home and he helped St. Joseph dispose of the murdered victim described above. The court found that there was sufficient evidence proving that the injuries had been inflicted on the victim while he was still alive. The Coroner testified that some of the wounds inflicted were consistent with sadomasochistic practices, but the Court made a point of highlighting that the manner in which the victim was murdered, along with inferred intent, indicated that this was a ritualistic sacrifice.
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February 1990, Utah. STATE of Utah v. Alan B. HADFIELD, 788 P2d 506 Convictions for sodomy and child molest; remanded back to court for evidentiary hearing.

Overview: A. Hadfield was convicted of sodomy and sexual abuse of his children after his children testified against him. He appealed based on claims of "newly discovered evidence." This was an allegation by a paralegal who stated that the therapist involved in counseling his children and others in this Mormon community was the common factor in these cases, and inferred that the therapist was responsible for the allegations. The appellate opinion cites that at "least fifteen adults and fifteen children were identified as participants in various unusual sexual activities, including instances of group abuse of children by adults. The activities described by the children involved satanic ritual, costumes and masks, photography equipment, men dressing in women's clothing, and frequent episodes of playing with and consuming human excrement. A specific instance of abuse related to Dr. Snow by W. and described by her at trial for example, involved defendant's removing feces from Ex.'s rectum with a spoon and forcing him to play with it." The appellate court remanded the case back to court for an evidentiary hearing if the affidavit by the paralegal had merit.

Note: According to the prosecutor, the judge reviewed the information and found that there was no evidence to support the claims of the paralegal. Alan Hadfield's conviction still stands and he was released from probation in 1998.
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April 1989, Harold Glenn Smith v. The State of Texas, No. B14-86-00659-CR, Lexis 794, Conviction for murder affirmed.

Overview: A group tricked one of their friends into accompanying them to a cemetery where they tortured him. A witness testified that Smith compared the planned murder of his victim with animal sacrifice rituals he had carried out before. The prosecution presented evidence of his satanic belief system.
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1989, New York. Monika Beerle, a dancer in New York was dismembered by her boyfriend, Daniel Rakowitz. He was found not guilty by reason of insanity but was sent to a mental institution. In 1992, Randy Charles Easterday, 27, was charged as a participant in the crime.

Overview: Reportedly, Monika's boyfriend was involved in a satanic cult and he had served a human finger in soup to homeless people. News report states, "the group to which Rakowitz and Easterday belonged has been identified by NY Newsday as a cult of devil worshipers who operated out of the Church of the Realized Fantasy. Police sources claimed they butchered her in a ritual sacrifice and a satanic offering." See, "New arrest in Swiss dancer slaying raises cult specter.", UPI, Feb. 18,1992 and "Acquitted 'cannibal killer' to stay put", UPI, Oct. 25, 1995
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November 1989, Gibreville, Gabon. Mba Ntem was found guilty and sentenced to death for murder and leading cannibalism rites.

Overview: Several members of this religious cult were found guilty of aiding in "cannibalism ceremonies by serving human flesh to worshippers." A victim's mutilated remains were found in another town, and a photo was published of the high priest with a knife in his teeth and a jar containing pieces of a victim's tongue in his manacled hands. In the ceremony led by Ntem, members of the cult ate the victim's stomach, liver, heart, lungs, tongue and genitals in what their leader called a "sacred plate." Some of the worshippers were unaware of the contents, Ntem told the court. The court prohibited other details from being released. The news article states that "Animism" is a loose religious belief popular in central Africa and other parts of the word that a spirit or force resides in every animate and inanimate object. See, "Death Sentence for High Priest in Cannibalism Trial," Associated Press, November 26, 1989.
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December 1988, State of Ohio. v. John L. Fryman, Case No. CA87-10-125, Lexis 5296, Conviction for murder affirmed.

Overview: Fryman took a woman to his "sorcery room where he had erected an altar for satanic worship". He shot her. The next day he cut off the woman's legs above the knees and disposed of them behind an old church. The rest of the body was never found. Fryman claimed that he had killed her because she had insulted him by bringing another magician to his trailer, and that he disposed of her legs behind the church because "it was the place he practiced magic. By throwing her legs there he increased the power of that spot."
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November 1988, Singapore. Three cult members hanged for
murder

Overview: Adrian Lim, 46, his wife, Tan Mui Choo, 34, and his girlfriend Hoe Kah Hong, 33, were convicted in 1983 of murdering Agnes Ng Siew Heok, eight, and Ghazali Marzuki, 10, in 1981. The three perpetrators belonged to a cult that believed sacrificing children could bring good luck. The three drank the children's blood after suffocating them in a bathtub. Another news report writes that the "macabre ritualistic killings included drinking the children's blood, trances, and electric shock 'treatments.'" See, "Three Singaporeans Hanged for Cult Murder of Children", Reuters, November 25, 1988 and "Three hanged in Singapore for ritual killings" UPI, Nov 25, 1988
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July 1988, New York, In the Matter of DANIEL "DD" et al., Alleged to be Abused and Neglected Children, 530 N.Y.S.2d 314, July 7, 1988. Finding of Neglect Affirmed.

Overview: The mother was appealing an order from Family Court finding she had neglected her children. She had allowed visitations to continue between the father and his girlfriend even though she knew that the girlfriends children had been removed from the home for sexual abuse, and she did not question the situation until the father and girlfriend were arrested on sexual abuse charges. Social Services had investigated the case. All children had been forced by threats of physical abuse to "engage in acts of sexual intercourse...among themselves and with adults." In addition, they described participation in forced acts of bestiality, as well as involvement in satanic rituals involving the sacrifice of animals and the drinking of blood. The court cites there was evidence that the mother may have been involved in these activities as well.
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August 1986, State of Maine v. Scott Waterhouse. 513 A.2d 862, Murder conviction affirmed

Overview: Waterhouse was convicted for the murder of a 12 yr. old girl. Evidence of Satanism and excerpts from the "Satanic Bible" were admitted at trial for purposes of showing motive and intent. During taped conversations with detectives, Waterhouse described his beliefs about sex and destruction rituals.
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March 1986, Commonwealth of Massachusetts v. Carl H. Drew, 489 N.E.2d 1233, Murder conviction affirmed.

Overview: Drew was convicted of the first degree murder of one of his satanic cult members in Fall River. The victim, Karen Marsden, was identified by a portion of the skull, clumps of hair, clothing, and jewelry. Evidence was admitted describing Marsden and another woman who worked for Drew as prostitutes. Another prostitute, Doreen Levesque was killed. According to witness testimony... "the killing was performed as a diabolic ritual during which the soul of Marsden was purportedly given to Satan." Earlier, Marsden had tried to sever relationship with the cult. Drew threatened to kill her on several occasions, which he finally did. "Murphy dragged Marsden by the throat and hair into the woods. As she did this, the defendant walked alongside while Fletcher and Davis followed close behind. Murphy and the defendant then began striking Marsden with rocks. After further brutalizing Marsden, the defendant ordered Murphy to slit Marsden's throat and Murphy complied. The defendant then tore the head from the body and kicked it." Drew later told another person that he had killed Marsden because "she wanted to leave the cult and that he wanted her to feel pain." The court specifically stated Drew's involvement in Satanism and the victim's desire to leave the cult was evidentially important to detail the context of the crime to the jury, as opposed to viewing the murders as just random acts of violence.
______________

February 1986, Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, v. Frank G. Costal, Jr., 505 A.2d 337, Murder conviction affirmed.

Overview: Expert testimony regarding Satanism and mind control was admitted into the court record to explain the killings of a mother and her 4 yr. old daughter. The killings appeared to be in retaliation for the mother's interference in a drug deal and homosexual relationship between her husband and Costal. The state submitted evidence that the murders were performed in a "ritualistic manner." The victims were stabbed in a similar fashion, in the same pattern. Ceremonial robes, books, posters, plastic skulls and bats, and marriage licenses drawn up by Costal and signed by him as a "high priest" of Satan were seized from his apartment. A witness testified that Costal told him of attendance at human sacrifices and that 17 was the number of stab wounds required at these ritualistic killings.
_________

December 1983, Detroit, Michigan. Arzell Jones was convicted of first-degree criminal sexual conduct, single counts of kidnapping and using a firearm during a felony. Linda Greene was convicted of two counts of first-degree criminal sexual conduct.

Overview: Arzell Jones, a private investigator, and Linda Greene, a Detroit policewoman, were convicted of sexually assaulting a 31-year-old woman who was held for more than three days and forced to take part in satanic rituals. The prosecutor stated the woman was a victim of some "cultism, some ultimate psychological warfare". See, "Judge Says Victim was Subjected to 'Reign of Terror' Man, Policewoman Guilty of Sexual Assault in Satanic Rituals," Detroit Free Press, December 3, 1983.
______________

May 1982, William Smith v. Commonwealth of Massachusetts, 436 N.E.2d 377, Immunity for witness was affirmed..

Overview: William Smith contested immunity for witness who was to testify against him for a murder. The appellate opinion states "these murders were among a series of ritual killings performed in the Fall River area by members of a Satanic cult ...The witness described the ritual that accompanied the murder, and named various participants." The witness also recanted
several times before finally testifying.
___________

September 1979, Philippines. A couple were charged with murder for "eating" two brothers..

Overview: Police reported that a couple, whose names were not disclosed, belonged to a sect which believed that cannibalism confers supernatural powers. The brothers were kidnapped from a city 650 miles from Manila. They were allegedly beheaded by members of the sect, then photographs of the beheadings were taken by a leader of the cult and sent to the widow of one of the victims. Officials stated it took a long time to bring charges because witnesses were too fearful of testifying due to fears of reprisals by the cannibal sect. See, "A man and his wife have been charged by Philippines police with eating two brothers." Reuters, September 20, 1979
_____________

This archive was compiled by "Karen Curio Jones". If there are any corrections or updates that need to be made, please contact karen.jones@mailcity.com

JBoy
11-08-2010, 11:20 AM
"There exists a shadowy government with its own Air Force, its own Navy, its own fundraising mechanism, and the ability to pursue its own ideas of national interest, free from all checks and balances, and free from the law itself."— Senator Daniel K. Inouye at the Iran Contra Hearings http://www.whale.to/b/images/michael-howard-drinking.jpg
http://www.bluemarbleimages.com/symbolvryal.jpg (http://www.whale.to/b/symbol_of_the_enemy.html)
http://www.whale.to/b/images/Levels.jpghttp://www.whale.to/b/53810234_93ac20c808_o.jpg

JBoy
11-08-2010, 04:06 PM
BIG PORN/Illuminati/FreemasonsAddiction (http://www.whale.to/vaccines/addiction.html) Sex Inc (http://www.whale.to/b/sex_inc.html) Sex (http://www.whale.to/a/sex_h.html)
'To encourage, and eventually legalize the use of drugs and make pornography an "art-form", which will be widely accepted and, eventually, become quite commonplace.'---Targets of the Illuminati and the Committee of 300 By Dr. John Coleman (http://www.whale.to/b/coleman1.html)
[See 1.1 on the Tone scale (http://www.whale.to/v/tone.html) to throw some light on porn industry workers and prostitutes. Porn is similar to Cocaine.]
See: Lap dancing (http://www.whale.to/b/lapdancing_h.html) Rape (http://www.whale.to/b/rape_h.html)
Pornographers
David Sullivan (http://www.whale.to/b/david_sullivan.html)
Richard Desmond (http://www.whale.to/b/richard_desmond.html)
Hugh Hefner (http://www.whale.to/b/playboy_h.html)
David Gold (http://www.whale.to/b/david_gold.html)
Ford (http://www.whale.to/b/ford1.html)

JBoy
11-08-2010, 07:56 PM
Bohemian Grove

JBoy
11-09-2010, 09:35 AM
The 13 Bloodlines: 1.Astor (http://www.whale.to/b/sp/astor.html) 2. Bundy (http://www.whale.to/b/sp/bundy.html) 3. Collins (http://www.whale.to/b/sp/collins.html) 4. DuPonts (http://www.whale.to/b/sp/duponts.html) 5. Freeman (http://www.whale.to/b/sp/freeman.html) 6.Kennedy (http://www.whale.to/b/sp/kennedy.html) 7. Li (http://www.whale.to/b/sp/li.html) 8. Onassis (http://www.whale.to/b/sp/onassis.html) 9. Reynolds (http://www.whale.to/b/sp/reynolds.html)
10. Rockefeller (http://www.whale.to/b/sp/rockefeller.html) 11. Rothschild (http://www.whale.to/b/sp/rothschild.html) 12. Russell (http://www.whale.to/b/sp/russell.html) 13. Van Duyn (http://www.whale.to/b/sp/van.html)
European Royal Families: Merovingian (http://www.whale.to/b/sp/merovingian.html)
Interconnected families: Krupp (http://www.whale.to/b/sp/krupps.html) Disney (http://www.whale.to/b/sp/disney.html) McDonald (http://www.whale.to/b/sp/mcdonald.html)

JBoy
11-09-2010, 10:28 AM
Bohemian Grove

JBoy
11-09-2010, 03:42 PM
Mass Graves Of Children Found Near Montreal; Another Duplessis Orphan Tells Of Being Tortured As A Child In CIA Experimentaion Programs Using Nazi Doctors
Pierre Sampson, now 60, is calling for justice an an open investigation to stop the murder of innocent children in government sponsored child experimentation programs. More than 50,000 children said to be illegally experimented but crooked officials on both sides of the border blocking investigation.
13 Apr 2006 By Greg Szymanski

Another Duplessis Orphan has come forward with horror stories, including electro shock therapy, straight jacket sessions and mind altering drugs injections after being subjected to illegal government experimentation programs as a young child.

Pierre Sampson, 60, of Vancouver, Canada endured the torturous treatment for six long years until at the age of 14 when he finally escaped.

But thousands of other Duplessis Orphans weren’t as lucky, as investigators recently uncovered a mass grave outside of Montreal where the bones of hundreds of children are buried in a mass grave.

Called the “pigsty” since the grave site is located next to a hog farm, Rod Vienneau, whose wife was also a child victim, said a push is now underway to exhume the bodies with strong resistance from governments on both side of the border, both denying any involvement in the face of compelling evidence to the contrary.

“I have been researching this atrocity for more than 10 years since my wife went public about being abused as one of the orphans,” said Rod Vienneau this week on Greg Szymanski’s radio show, The Investigative Journal, regarding the Duplessis Orphans, who may number more than 50,000 and named after former Prime Minister Maurice Duplessis, a key figure in the child experimentation cover-up.

“We have documentation proving the link among with the CIA, the United States government and the Canadian government, all of them willing accomplices to the illegal experimentation of children.

“Thousands of children have died, thousands of others have endured great suffering and there remains about 3,000 surviving victims we know about who are still seeking justice. What’s even more astonishing is that the illegal experimentation is still taking place while we speak.”

Sampson, who went public for the first time in the United States on The Investigative Journal, is one of tens of thousands of children who were reduced to experimental guinea pigs by unscrupulous doctors, some known Nazi war criminals in a CIA program starting in the 1950’s

Recently, a Canadian high court in 2004 awarded damages to adult mind control victims in a related case, pinning the CIA with responsibility as well as their unscrupulous doctors, including Dr. Ewin Cameron.

For a further look at Dr. Cameron’s nefarious activities, a book called The Most Dangerous Game traces the history of top-secret CIA mind control operation MK-ULTRA: from the covert importation of NAZI scientists at the end of WWII, to the illegal brainwashing experiments conducted on the patients of psychiatric researcher, Dr Cameron

The same type of testing Dr Cameron and others performed on adults is now being traced to innocent children, as advocates for the Duplessis Orphans contend their evil knows no age limits.

Regarding Sampson’s personal story, he said at the age of six he was transferred from a Catholic orphanage to a mental institution even though he was both mentally and physically sound as church and civil authorities overnight changed his paperwork, indicating he was mentally ill.

“After researching what happened,” said Sampson, who also appeared this week on The Investigative Journal. “The Church made a deal with the government to turn over perfectly healthy children in return for money, giving the doctors the ability to experiment at will since we were all considered insane.

“To this day my records haven’t been changed. Although I have never been mentally ill, my records still haven’t been changed.”

The link Sampson makes between the infiltrated Catholic Church and corrupted civil authorities is disturbing, indicating a consolidation of corruption not only in government but extending all the way to Rome and beyond.

According to Vienneau and Sampson, this inhumane treatment was accomplished with the full authority, cooperation and funding of the American and Canadian governments together with corrupted elements of the Catholic Church, one of the government’s main suppliers of children used like experimental guinea pigs.

“I hope one day we can get justice and remove this evil element of people from the continent,” said Vienneau. “How can we live in a society and trust a government who is killing our own children? These people will never admit to what they done and the only thing we can do is gather enough support among good people to have these corrupted leaders removed.”

Vienneau also outlined what his main motives are in seeking justice for his wife, Sampson and the many other children abused by the illegal experimentation programs.

“Criminal acts: Horrific criminal acts were done to thousands of innocent children here on Canadian soil ranging from murders, tortures; disappearance of children; lobotomy's and experimental drugs and falsely labeling thousands of innocent young children from 1935 to 1975 and nobody has yet been held accountable for these free criminal acts done to the Duplessis orphans.

“Thousands of orphans were falsely labeled mentally ill, and today, this label still hangs heavy on the orphans shoulders, This label has not yet been erased, this alone is a criminal act.

“The Quebec government, the College of Physicians of Quebec; the Roman Catholic church of Quebec; the Quebec Public Trustee;(Guardianship) and the federal government of Canada and America have not yet acknowledged the harm done to thousands of young children here in Quebec.

“Constitutional Rights : The Quebec government took away the Duplessis orphans rights to defend themselves in a court of law since 1995, all though four members of parliament stated that the orphans could take a lawyer at any time for their case, but it has been 11 years now that many orphans have been trying to get a lawyer for their case but to no avail.

“Lawyer Daniel Lighter, told me flatly that the Duplessis orphans case is locked shut tight since over fifteen years. The Duplessis orphans have no Constitutional rights, it all boils down to a huge cover up.”

For more informative articles, go to www.arcticbeacon.com (http://www.arcticbeacon.com/)

Editor’s Note: It’s beyond the realm of human comprehension how newspaper owners in the mainstream lack the decency to mount an investigation for the memory of all the dead children and the many others who have suffered at the hands of corrupted politicians and church leaders.

By ignoring this story for more than five decades, major newspaper owners in the United States should be branded as co-conspirators along with the corrupted church leaders and politicians, who all march to the altar in lockstep every Sunday with the blood of the Duplessis Orphans dripping from their dirty hands.
Greg Szymanski

JBoy
11-10-2010, 05:44 AM
Insider Says We're Entering "the Age of Satan"


savethemales.ca - Insider Says We're Entering "the Age of Satan" (http://www.henrymakow.com/entering_the_age_of_satan_says.html)

JBoy
11-12-2010, 06:03 PM
Rothschilds are MAJOR Zionists, as Elders of Zion/Order of Zion.
For the last 2 centuries, Rothschilds strictly marry cousins.
Rothschilds MAJOR bavarian Illuminati, & Carbonarism (Alta Vendita) led by Karl Rothschild.

16 of 18 marriages of Mayer Amschel Rothschilds' grandchildren are contracted to 1st cousins.

The Rothschild, through Israeli-British government proxies, created the steps to create Israel.

The Rothschilds adopted the hexagram/Seal of Solomon (Israeli flag) as their coat of arms. Mayer Amschel Bauer became M.A. Rothschild (Rothschild = red shield [German] = red seal of solomon).

14,000 wars in 5,500 years of 'recorded' history with 10 yrs of REAL, ACTUAL PEACE.

The Rothschilds built the Knesset in Israel
The Rothschilds 'contributed' to the Treaty imposed on Germany to end WWI; they 'contributed' to themselves the German-owned railway system...IN PALESTINE!!!
King David rejected the hexagram, but his son Solomon didn't, whom worshipped Ashtoreth (AKA: star, astarte, chiun, kaiwan, remphan & SATURN).

City of Rome originally called Saturnia (City of Saturn).
Saturn important to Mithra & DRUID 'religion'.

Kuhn, Loeb Co., ran by Rothschilds, funded Mormons.

Rothschilds OWN the Catholic 'church'.

H-core Satanic spin-offs : Sabbatain/Frankism ---> Sabbatai Zevi, Nathan of Gaza, Jacob Frank, Rothschilds.

Victor Rothschild ---> MI-5 (Israeli-Britain Intel.) ---> ORIGINAL member of Rhodes' Round Table Group ---> Rothschilds funded Rhodes.

Rockefellars (Rothschild agents) are Merrano Jews.

Jews + Masons + Intel. agencies + international banking (userers) + Order of Zion + Catholics + Trilateral Commission + CFR + 'New Age' + cults = ROTHSCHILDS

sublimetruth_com
11-13-2010, 08:48 PM
YouTube - New World Order, Freemasonry, Illuminati,CFR or Bilderberg - What is the Truth (1 of 2)

brice_fallsteen
12-05-2010, 04:02 PM
The International Order of Job's Daughters plays an important role in serving the community, visiting hospitals and homes for the elderly to offer friendship to people who might be lonely and sad. They have food drives and other activities to provide for the less fortunate.

Their charity, the Hearing Impaired Kid's Endowment (The HIKE Fund), provides hearing assistive devices for children in need. Popular "hikes for HIKE," provide a special charitable service to communities. Their work with hearing-impaired children has led many local groups, called Bethels, to learn sign language. These young women are rightfully proud to be "kids helping kids! "

LightCraft
12-11-2010, 04:02 PM
I have never known any Mason to be evil. So to answer your question: No.


I am a Master Mason. And I have found the brothers in my lodge to be of the finest caliber and fantastic friends.

BlueAngel
12-11-2010, 08:07 PM
I have never known any Mason to be evil. So to answer your question: No.


I am a Master Mason. And I have found the brothers in my lodge to be of the finest caliber and fantastic friends.

And, because you say so, this is so?

LightCraft
12-12-2010, 04:26 AM
And, because you say so, this is so?

Just sharing my observations. Take it any way you like.

Phantom Monkey
12-12-2010, 08:12 AM
This thread stinks of liars.
I can smell a rat from a mile ahead.
Oh so the Freemasons donate, they do charity?
Please. Lucky Luciano also done charity. So did John Gotti.
Have you not read the laws of power?
Cover you asses by giving away some charity? You make me laugh.
You are corrupt to the bone.
So, whats the deal with that?
John Gotti done charity, was he a good guy?

Give it to me, come on, lets see what kind of manure comes out of you little pie holes...

moondoggy2
12-13-2010, 07:58 AM
I don't believe The Masons are entirely evil. They just know what they want, and will do just about anything to achieve that. The ends justifies the means, right?

BlueAngel
12-13-2010, 10:12 PM
I don't believe The Masons are entirely evil. They just know what they want, and will do just about anything to achieve that. The ends justifies the means, right?

You said the following:

If someone knows what they want and does just about anything to achieve it, that's okay because the end justifies the means.

Please contemplate that which you wrote.

Think about it intensely and get back to me after you have applied DEEP THOUGHT to your comment.

Or don't.

JBoy
12-25-2010, 03:54 PM
No Room In The Inn

According to Jim Shaw, former 33rd degree Mason, who officially resigned from Masonry, after becoming a Christian and studying the Bible, as he wrote in Deadly Deception: "there is underlying all Masonic thinking and writing, an attitude and spirit of elitism which says, "Masonry is not for everyone, just for the select few." At the same time Masonry teaches it is the only true religion and that all other religions are but corrupted and perverted forms of Masonry.

This is both elitist and contradictory, in that it leaves no hope for the non-elite to ever be able to find the "true religion." Freemasonry proudly proclaims it makes good men better; but this leaves no provision for bad men to ever be able to become good." He continues: "It is significant, I think, that those whom Masonry rejects and excludes are the very ones Jesus sought out to accept and minister to:

The Lodge excludes and rejects the blind, for they cannot see to engage in the signs and due-guards; it rejects the crippled and maimed, for they cannot assume the body positions necessary for the signs and due-guards. The deaf are excluded because they cannot hear the "secret" words. The poor are excluded, for they cannot pay the fees and dues. The mentally challenged are rejected because they cannot memorize the correct questions and answers to be recited in rituals in order to function in the Lodge. The emotionally ill are rejected because they cannot be trusted with the "secrets." Historically, blacks and women have been excluded simply because they are considered unsuitable." YET, its members consider themselves very sane and stable.Who are they kidding ??.. All have mental questions to even join in the first place.To be so corrupt....so criminally insane,mentally insane...to gangstalk the helpless....to murder the helpless...to teach there children to hate the "profane", you and i, the non masons...to worship not 1 but 3 evil gods.....to join something and swear to, not having NO idea what you have sworn to...pure insanity !!! ....to enjoy little boys and girls.....even there own children.... and there mothers.....themselves in the rituals.


"Jesus, on the other hand proclaims that "whosoever will, may come" and receive His gift of redemption and that all may "take the water of life freely" (Rev. 22:17). He especially reached out to the blind, the crippled, the mentally challenged and mentally ill, the poor and the unwanted - the very ones Masonry excludes and rejects (as unworthy)."

Jesus Forbid the Bloody Pagan Oaths That Are Required of All Members of Freemasonry In Matthew 5:34-37, He said "But I say to you, make no oath at all either by heaven, for it is the throne of God, or by the earth, for it is the footstool of His feet, or by Jerusalem, for it is the city of the grat King. "Nor shall you make an oath on your head for you cannot make one hair white or black, "But let your statement be, 'Yes, yes' or 'No, no', and anything beyond these is of evil."
The oath of the 1st degree of Masonry, that of an Entered Apprentice, concludes with: "...binding myself under no less penalty than that of having my throat cut from ear to ear, my tongue torn out by its roots and buried in the rough sands of the sea at low-water mark where the tide ebbs and flows twice in twenty-four hours, should I ever knowingly or willingly violate this my solemn oath and obligation as an Entered Apprentice Mason, so help me God."

The oath for the 2nd degree of Masonry, that of Fellow Craft, ends as follows: "...binding myself under no less penalty than having my left breast torn open, my heart plucked out, and given as a prey to the wild beasts of the field and the fowls of the air, so help me God..."

The 3rd degree oath, to become a Master Mason, is: "...having my body severed in twain, my bowels taken from thence and burned to ashes, the ashes scattered to the four winds of heaven, so that no more trace or remembrance may be had of so vile and perjured wretch as I..."

The oath to become a Knight of Malta (after taking in hand the upper part of a human skull containing wine): "This pure wine I now take in testimony of my belief in the mortality of the body and the immortality of the soul and may this libation appear as a witness against me both here and hereafter - and as the sins of the world were laid upon the head of the Savior, so may all the sins committed by the person whose skull this was be heaped upon my head, in addition to my own, should I ever knowingly or willingly violate or transgress any obligation that I have heretofore taken, take at this time, or shall at any future period take in relation to any degree of Masonry or order of Knighthood. So help me God."
Each of the above pagan Masonic oaths, except the shriners, which is sworn to Allah, the God of the Qu'ran, and of Muslims, conclude with the words, 'So help me God.' For a Christian to call upon God as a witness to these evil barbaric oaths, as he is voluntarily binding himself to a spirit of fear by agreeing to be murdered by his lodge brothers, or to mutilate and murder any Masonic brother who reveals Masonic secrets, is an incredibly sad and spiritually blind deed, and an abomination to God.

Jesus said in Matthew 10:28: "And fear not them who kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell." In 2 Timothy 1:7, the Holy Spirit, writing through Paul tells us: "For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind."

brice_fallsteen
12-25-2010, 08:46 PM
Do you have any supporting documents in regards to your claim of people with disabilities not allowed membership? I can only speak from the experiences I've had in a limited number of lodges but I've met many mason men who have disabilities that limit their ability to do much of the customs and courtesies.

JBoy
12-26-2010, 05:53 AM
dou have any supporting documents that u ADMIT SUCH ??

KSigMason
12-26-2010, 06:35 AM
No JBoy never has actual documentation of his lies. He is a mouth piece for hate.

JBoy
12-26-2010, 06:50 AM
The world is full of truth..
Hate, that reminds me of a tactic of long ago...
U are so dumbed down as all freemasons to see the real light of day, NOT morning(Lucifer).. As I say, U work in a secret society.... I admit, u belong there.. weird.....Masons want to cheat the system, get ahead by cheating god and country.., favors... well,were tired of it. U work like every body else in this world.The day is near for u...to repay the world what has been taken away,FROM GOD>COUNTRY AND MAN ...U ROT everything u touch...It festers...then ur children are infested...

I know ... masons in my family, Baylor Univ.....Air Force....
And 33rds... one has went into the Illumanati.. U are a fool !!!
my niece hates her masonic dad...he abused her and my other nieces and nephews.. harassing/gangstalking women with children......elderly.....sick.. DO I HATE,
U Fuc** right, what u gonna do about it !!!!

KSigMason
12-26-2010, 07:19 AM
U are so dumbed down as all freemasons to see the real light of day, NOT morning(Lucifer)
Jesus is referred to as a morning star and the bible says to let the light of the morning into your heart.

Masons want to cheat the system, get ahead by cheating god and country.., favors... well,were tired of it.
I've worked hard to get where I am, most of it done before I joined the Freemasons. I've never used my Masonic connection to get ahead.

Ah, and it comes down to it. You have some family problems. I met a woman like you once, she was the same insane way and it took most of a Hawaii-bound flight to figure her out. You need to work out your issues and stop blaming the Masons for everything. If you did actually have family members who were Masons they deserved to be expelled for their actions as they are un-Masonic and you should know that Masons don't make bad men into good men. They can only make good men better.

JBoy
12-26-2010, 07:25 AM
masons dont work hard at all... they are parisites.
u are a blood sucker....ur papa is a blood sucker.

KSigMason
12-26-2010, 07:27 AM
masons dont work hard at all... they are parisites.
u are a blood sucker....ur papa is a blood sucker.
I come from a middle income family and make just about that myself. I have never taken a dime for welfare nor a handout from others. All my possessions are a result of my hard work and doing. That is something I am most proud of. I have at least served my country and don't need to rely on others to tell me about my god. My faith is not so weak that I need others to define it for me.

JBoy
12-26-2010, 07:30 AM
u are a deadbeat dad.. ... always sponging off of people..
u are a worhless piece of shit

KSigMason
12-26-2010, 07:33 AM
u are a deadbeat dad.. ... always sponging off of people..
u are a worhless piece of shit
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA I'm not a Dad, I have no kids...that I know of. I've never sponged, I'm a frequent donator to various charities.

Piece of shit? How eloquent.

JBoy
12-26-2010, 07:38 AM
what charities, fraternal order of dirty cops...red crossed.....another mason charity... haaa sounds like u are a child trying to prove u are what u aint !!!
the public is viewing u.. they see how dumb u are.. this posting is really childish. do u agree ?? no, because u are a child.. u cop dad probably abused u...so u never grow up...u are in a bubble.. pop that bitch !!!

KSigMason
12-26-2010, 07:44 AM
what charities, fraternal order of dirty cops...red crossed.....another mason charity... haaa sounds like u are a child trying to prove u are what u aint !!!
the public is viewing u.. they see how dumb u are.. this posting is really childish. do u agree ?? no, because u are a child.. u cop dad probably abused u...so u never grow up...u are in a bubble.. pop that bitch !!!
Unlike you my dad never touched me or my sisters. I was never abused. The public may be intrigued, but its very few that believe the sinister bs that you believe. "Know thyself" Live by this rule. My dad knows who he is and he raised me just fine. I have had a great life - no regrets. You seem to have the family issues and just because that is true doesn't mean the rest of us are all neurotic little yahoos.

JBoy
12-26-2010, 07:50 AM
U are not normal to join such a satanic society unless u are of that nature

JBoy
12-26-2010, 07:52 AM
Originally Posted by JBoy http://www.clubconspiracy.com/forum/images/clubconspiracy/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.clubconspiracy.com/forum/f32/masons-evil-5791-28.html#post72021)
what charities, fraternal order of dirty cops...red crossed.....another mason charity... haaa sounds like u are a child trying to prove u are what u aint !!!
the public is viewing u.. they see how dumb u are.. this posting is really childish. do u agree ?? no, because u are a child.. u cop dad probably abused u...so u never grow up...u are in a bubble..

U are a clown.....

KSigMason
12-26-2010, 11:16 AM
U are not normal to join such a satanic society unless u are of that nature
Thank God I didn't join a Satanic organization then

JBoy
12-26-2010, 12:10 PM
"(Bill Schnoebelen) had been a 90 degree Freemason when most people think Freemasonry goes only as high as 33 degrees. He explained how there is one particular level in one branch of Masonry whereby a Mason swears, “I will keep the secrets of a Royal Arch Companion, murder and treason not excepted.”"---How We Discovered the World's First Ex-Vampire

If anyone looks through MORALS AND DOGMA, the Masonic ‘bible’ written by Confederate General Albert Pike in the mid nineteenth century, one will find a diagram of ‘Baphomet, the Hermaphroditic Goat’ drawn in an inverted pentagram. Notice that the face looks reptilian, perhaps even Draconian. Carol and I believe that this is the image that the 32nd degree and above Masons regard as Satan, their sponsor. We believe that a Draconian or off-planet reptilian show up in their secret upper level meetings and that the humans are just stupid enough to think he/she’s a devil ;-) It’s no small wonder that LaRouche refers to Satanism as ‘infantilism.’ [2002] The Adventures of Don & Carol Croft – Parts 11 – 20

"Sexual vampirism goes on and this explains why there is an epidemic of child sexual abuse among Masons, as they believe (also commonly held among Illuminists) that if you have sex with a child you steal some of their youth and that in turn makes you live longer, and if you have sex with lots of children and the younger the better, you can live virtually forever and this is the promise held out by Masons."--Bill Schnoebelen (Interview with an Ex-Vampire).

Many of the highest-placed leaders in the Nazi party, including Hitler, Roehm, Forster, von Schirach and almost all of his bodyguards were gay. Hitler surrounded himself with homosexuals and even retrieved Roehm from Bolivia, making him Deputy Fuhrer. This knowledge enabled outside countries like Britain and ideologies like the Freemasons to control Hitler, his high command and his bodyguards. Hitler and his band of merry bandits became puppets with wooden strings. In this way, any foreign society can be destroyed with a leader hiding their sexuality. Hitler, Roehm, Forster and von Schirach took part in destroying their own societies while enjoying the power it gave them. Hitler was a double agent prime minister. He worked for a foreign country (Britain) and a foreign ideology (the Freemasons). The formula proved so effective it is still used today, in politics and the media, especially with TV personalities, radio announcers, prime ministers and presidents, both male and female. Hitler was a British Agent by Greg Hallett p.65

Whenever you have a high-ranking homosexual fronting as a married heterosexual, you have a malleable spy who will go to any treasonous lengths and use all their resources just to maintain one or all of their positions. Many homosexual Freemasons use Freemasonry and marriage as a form of cover. Freemasons have a high rate of child-sex abuse, paedophilia and incest, with accounts suggesting that Freemasons sexually abuse a third of their daughters and granddaughters.
Paedophiles control Freemasons, because Freemasons consider paedophiles to be close to royals. Royals use their illegitimate children for supply and control for paedophiles. Police are a Freemasonry organisation and serve the British Crown. Thus Police cover for paedophiles and expect promotions when they do so. Freemasons admire paedophiles and a Freemason will do anything a paedophile asks them to do. This does not exclude dropping the Berlin Wall.
Because the Freemasons control the police and judiciary, Freemasons are rarely charged for their incest, child-sex abuse and paedophilia. When they are discovered, the first step is to cover up. When it becomes too obvious they are often murdered. Sometimes these murders are real and other times they are fake with new identities established elsewhere. Hitler was a British Agent by Greg Hallett p.205

Studying freemasonry gave me an understanding of how evil works in our world. The entrance lodge, the blue lodge, the first 3 degrees are all warm, loving, and the energy forms created are quite powerful and pleasing. This gets you in. Makes you feel at home. This is how modern cults work, as well, take note. They get you in, make you feel loved, you are among friends, we are your real family, like that. Then once in, the good light vanishes with each degree and upward movement, and the false light, the dark light, slowly takes its place. I almost died in a lodge meeting—my very last—as they tried to kill me there using black magic. My heart stopped, I found I could not breathe, and fell over near-dead in lodge. Except for one person, no one stopped the proceedings in lodge or even bothered to help me. I was carried outside of lodge and laid on a table. Then my heart started again and I found myself recovering, still hearing the proceedings of the lodge inside and only the one person standing next to me, “are you okay?” Sure…
I never went back after that. I had what I needed for the book. These Luciferic souls showed me exactly what they were inside. I saw firsthand how the thing worked and had direct experience of what happens to a man or woman when a collective of dark souls gathered to do harm to another. My first experience with “blasting.” And I was the victim. Lot of that around these days, you know. [2008] The Long and Winding Internet Road By Don Bradley, March 14th, 2008

Karl Marx, Lenin and Trotsky, all Jewish Freemasons, were essentially dysfunctional losers who were employed by the Illuminist bankers to hoodwink the masses. Lenin for example had been an unsuccessful lawyer who had only six cases in which he defended shoplifters. He lost them all. A week later he gave up the law to become a highly paid revolutionary. Lenin declared: "Peace means quite simply the domination of Communism over the entire world." His reign of terror caused nine million deaths but you never see him compared to Hitler. The secret police, the Cheka, dominated by Jews, published the names of 1.7 million people they murdered in 1918-1919, including 300,000 priests. "A river of blood flowed through Russia," Lina writes. "According to official Soviet Reports, 1,695,904 people were executed from January 1921 to April 1922. Among these victims were bishops, professors, doctors, officers, policemen, lawyers, civil servants, writers...Their crime was 'anti social thinking' " Did Rothschild Write The Protocols of Zion ? By Henry Makow Ph.D (September 21, 2003)

The Fraternity Pub. Co., 1891, p. 225.) I mention John Collins as an example of a powerful 18th century Freemason, who was part of what appears to be the Collins Illuminati family. In previous articles, we have documented how the early 18th century Astor's and DuPont's were active Freemasons. The history of these top families does agree with Bonewitz that in order to continue to practice their witchcraft they used the cover of Freemasonry. Bloodlines of the Illuminati by Fritz Springmeier: Bundy

The Freemasons and the Illuminati are hand in glove. I don't care if this steps on any toes, it's a fact. The Masonic temple at Alexandria, Virginia (the city itself was named after Alexandria, Egypt, and is a hotbed of Illuminati activity) is a center in the Washington, DC area for Illuminati scholarship and teaching. I was taken there at intervals for testing, to step up a level, for scholarship, and high ceremonies. The leaders in this Masonic group were also Illuminists. This has been true of every large city I have lived in. The top Freemasons were also top Illuminists. My maternal grandparents were both high ranking Masons in the city of Pittsburgh, Pa. (president of the Eastern Star and 33rd degree Mason) and they both were also leaders in the Illuminati in that area. Part 4: The Illuminati - Freemason Connection

Let’s digress just to let people in on Freemasonry’s involvement with acting and motion pictures. The famous 233 Club was a Masonic chapter for actors who were Freemasons. Examples of actors who were Freemasons include John Aasen, Gene Autry, Monte Blue and Humphrey Bogart, Douglas McClean, John Wayne.

Then there is T.V. DJ Dick Clark. Examples of Motion picture executives who were Freemasons incl. Ellis G. Arnall (Pres. of the Soc. of Ind. Motion Picture Producers), Will H. Hays (Czar of motion pictures 1922-45, and Pres. Motion Picture Produces & Distributors of Amer. Inc.), Benj. B. Kahane (v.p. & dir. Assoc. of Motion Picture Producers, Inc.), Carl Laemmle (Pres. Univ. Pictures Corp til ’36), Frank E. Mullen ( man. dept of info. RCA, VP NBC ‘39-’46, exec. VP NBC ‘46-’48), David Sarnoff (Chrm. of Bd. Radio Corp. of Amer. & ,,father" of American television), Jack M. Warner (v.p. of Warner Bros.) and the President & dir. of Universal Pictures since 1952. The Freemasons have made much of Walt Disney’s membership in their membership sales pitches. Because the 2 Disney brothers’ chief contributions to the production of Disney films were the finances and occasionally the ideas used in a film, it is rather misrepresentative of things that Walt Disney got all the credit for the success and quality of the Disney cartoons. Chapter 5. Deeper Insights into the Illuminati Formula by Fritz Springmeier & Cisco Wheeler

You remember Aleister Crowley. He was a 33rd degree Mason. I talked to Bill Schnoebelen one time and asked him, “Where did the Masons get the sodomy?” and he said, “It came by Aleister Crowley from black magic Hinduism.” Well, that isn’t the only place it came from. Deprogrammer Interview with Marion Knox: In the House of the Strongman, Sodomy is the Key - by Elana Freeland

KSigMason
12-26-2010, 11:03 PM
Bill was never a Freemason. His life story is filled with lies and contradictions. And no Freemasonry doesn't go to 90 or 99. That is the Rite of Memphis and Mizraim which is not recognized by any true Masonic body and in fact, joining one Rite of MM can get you expelled from the fraternity. I love how he was somehow a Mormon, Catholic, Satanist, Wiccan, Freemason, and blah blah blah.

BlueAngel
12-26-2010, 11:16 PM
Bill was never a Freemason. His life story is filled with lies and contradictions. And no Freemasonry doesn't go to 90 or 99. That is the Rite of Memphis and Mizraim which is not recognized by any true Masonic body and in fact, joining one Rite of MM can get you expelled from the fraternity. I love how he was somehow a Mormon, Catholic, Satanist, Wiccan, Freemason, and blah blah blah.

What is so GOD awful about the Rite of Memphis and Mizraim that can get you expelled from the oh so wonderful Freemason fraternity?

KSigMason
12-26-2010, 11:19 PM
What is so GOD awful about the Rite of Memphis and Mizraim that can get you expelled from the oh so wonderful Freemason fraternity?
Irregular Freemasonry don't follow the same rules, they don't have the same requirements, they refuse to follow the traditions and charges that every Grand Lodge follows, they allow atheists into their movements, but are slowly dying away.

KSigMason
12-26-2010, 11:29 PM
The Ancient and Primitive Rites of Memphis and Mizraim are groups for fringe "Freemasons". They were considered a degree mill of clandestine degrees and never received recognition. In fact, Yarker was expelled from Freemasonry as he became belligerent in trying to push his new order.

BlueAngel
12-27-2010, 12:00 AM
Irregular Freemasonry don't follow the same rules, they don't have the same requirements, they refuse to follow the traditions and charges that every Grand Lodge follows, they allow atheists into their movements, but are slowly dying away.

OMG!

How awful!

They don't follow the same rules and don't have the same requirements and refuse to follow the traditions and allow atheists into their movements.

I say off with their heads!

Dangermouse
12-27-2010, 12:04 AM
OMG!

How awful!

They don't follow the same rules and don't have the same requirements and refuse to follow the traditions and allow atheists into their movements.

I say off with their heads!

Doesn't have to be off with their heads, just means they aren't freely accepted as part of the organization. If they don't fallow the same rules, regulations, requirements, and adhere to the traditions, are they really part of the organization at all, or just another group using a catchy name to get attention?

BlueAngel
12-27-2010, 12:08 AM
Doesn't have to be off with their heads, just means they aren't freely accepted as part of the organization. If they don't fallow the same rules, regulations, requirements, and adhere to the traditions, are they really part of the organization at all, or just another group using a catchy name to get attention?

It was a joke.

Didn't require a response.

But, thanks, anyway.

KSigMason
12-27-2010, 02:52 AM
OMG!

How awful!

They don't follow the same rules and don't have the same requirements and refuse to follow the traditions and allow atheists into their movements.

I say off with their heads!
That's a little extreme, I am content with them no receiving recognition, but to each his own I guess.

JBoy
12-27-2010, 05:35 AM
baby mason boy:
Is PIKE a liar ??
Manly ???
BESANT....CROWLEY....Manson????? HITLER.....Son of sam ???

all evil as hell, as u are. a nobody no nothing gutter rat
i suppose i can gather ALL the names and ...and ofcourse, to u all liars, never was in the masons. how bizarres ur ???

KSigMason
12-27-2010, 06:13 AM
baby mason boy:
Is PIKE a liar ??
Manly ???
BESANT....CROWLEY....Manson????? HITLER.....Son of sam ???

all evil as hell, as u are. a nobody no nothing gutter rat
i suppose i can gather ALL the names and ...and ofcourse, to u all liars, never was in the masons. how bizarres ur ???
Manly P Hall and Pike were Masons, but the rest you named are not. Sorry little boy.

JBoy
12-27-2010, 06:53 AM
November 2, 2007

SAN FRANCISCO -- The LAPD and the Boy Scouts of America may not be held liable for alleged sexual abuse of teenage boys by a former police chief, the California Supreme Court ruled unanimously Thursday. The state high court said the alleged victims had failed to show that the LAPD and the scouting group knew or should have known that retired Deputy Police Chief David Kalish had committed sexual misconduct with other minors before he was accused by the teenagers. The decision clarified a law that permits victims of child abuse older than 26 to sue a molester's employer or organization if they can show the employer "knew or had reason to know or was otherwise on notice" of any sexual misconduct by the employee or volunteer. Without such evidence, a victim older than 26 is barred from suing by legal time limits.

KSigMason
12-28-2010, 05:11 AM
November 2, 2007

SAN FRANCISCO -- The LAPD and the Boy Scouts of America may not be held liable for alleged sexual abuse of teenage boys by a former police chief, the California Supreme Court ruled unanimously Thursday. The state high court said the alleged victims had failed to show that the LAPD and the scouting group knew or should have known that retired Deputy Police Chief David Kalish had committed sexual misconduct with other minors before he was accused by the teenagers. The decision clarified a law that permits victims of child abuse older than 26 to sue a molester's employer or organization if they can show the employer "knew or had reason to know or was otherwise on notice" of any sexual misconduct by the employee or volunteer. Without such evidence, a victim older than 26 is barred from suing by legal time limits.
And what does this have to do with the Masons?

JBoy
12-28-2010, 05:20 AM
Brain Dead !!!!

KSigMason
12-28-2010, 05:37 AM
You assume too much little boy.

JBoy
12-28-2010, 05:48 AM
You wish i was a "little boy", dont u ??

JBoy
12-28-2010, 06:20 AM
Now, I cant be clearer....GOOD cops dont do this !!!
ONLY bad cops...ANYTHING bad has a stamp on it..MASONRY.
They rot everything they touch..then cesspools form..then sewer rats appear...real simple bird brain !!!

About 1.75 years later we now have 1,730 threads about cops committing sex offenses out of 10,431 total threads in the news section, which is about 16.6%. There are sure a lot of cops out there committing sex offenses. Most of the stories appear to be offenses committed against children. Cops must like them young. Maybe they resist less, and are easily manipulated by someone they are taught to look up too. Sworn officers of the law committing a sex offense against someone in custody appears to be on the rise. The person might have to perform a sexual act to get out of some traffic infraction, or perform sexual acts if they are already incarcerated for the sexual gratification of those in charge of their welfare.

Keep in mind that this is only the tip of the iceberg when it comes to reporting sex offenses committed by sworn officers of the law. I am only scanning a limited amount of these stories online, and lots more are missed. Please help out an post stories along with pictures of these officers in the Law Enforcement Sex Offender thread. They need to be exposed for the safety of the children. More often then not, their information won't appear on the various offender registries because SOL's tend to be a protected class of citizens even when they commit a sex crime. People can come here instead to find their information; although, they won't have a current address.

Please write and tell your representatives in government that cops must not be a protected class. Some legislators are trying to pass bills into law that would protect SOL's information from being displayed online. Supposedly it is to protect the SOL's and their families. However equal protection of the law should apply to everyone, and cops shouldn't become a protected class when displaying information. Especially when SOL's are so eager to display information about you online if you have been convicted of a crime. In some cases, such as in Ohio, you don't even have to be convicted of the crime for your information to appear online.

Read about all the sex abuses in this forum
http://www.copwatch.net/forums/foru...?s=&forumid=108 (http://www.copwatch.net/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=108)

JBoy
12-28-2010, 06:34 AM
Stop child abuse and perverted Masons

KSigMason
12-28-2010, 07:34 AM
Stop child abuse and perverted Masons
Nice sign.

JBoy
12-28-2010, 08:11 AM
here is a better one !!!

JBoy
12-28-2010, 08:12 AM
What does that mean real mason ???

KSigMason
12-28-2010, 08:44 AM
It's quite apparent he is an elderly gentleman.

JBoy
12-28-2010, 06:39 PM
the following may be useful to the initiate in the world of dealing with veiled and half-truth, lies, and suppression of truth when serious crimes are studied in public forums. This, sadly, includes every day news media, one of the worst offenders with respect to being a source of disinformation. Where the crime involves a conspiracy, or a conspiracy to cover up the crime, there will invariably be a disinformation campaign launched against those seeking to uncover and expose the truth and/or the conspiracy. There are specific tactics which disinfo artists tend to apply, as revealed here. Also included with this material are seven common traits of the disinfo artist which may also prove useful in identifying players and motives. The more a particular party fits the traits and is guilty of following the rules, the more likely they are a professional disinfo artist with a vested motive. People can be bought, threatened, or blackmailed into providing disinformation, so even "good guys" can be suspect in many cases.

A rational person participating as one interested in the truth will evaluate that chain of evidence and conclude either that the links are solid and conclusive, that one or more links are weak and need further development before conclusion can be arrived at, or that one or more links can be broken, usually invalidating (but not necessarily so, if parallel links already exist or can be found, or if a particular link was merely supportive, but not in itself key to) the argument. The game is played by raising issues which either strengthen or weaken (preferably to the point of breaking) these links. It is the job of a disinfo artist to interfere with these evaluations... to at least make people think the links are weak or broken when, in truth, they are not... or to propose alternative solutions leading away from the truth. Often, by simply impeding and slowing down the process through disinformation tactics, a level of victory is assured because apathy increases with time and rhetoric.

It would seem true in almost every instance, that if one cannot break the chain of evidence for a given solution, revelation of truth has won out. If the chain is broken either a new link must be forged, or a whole new chain developed, or the solution is invalid and a new one must be found... but truth still wins out. There is no shame in being the creator or supporter of a failed solution, chain, or link, if done with honesty in search of the truth. This is the rational approach. While it is understandable that a person can become emotionally involved with a particular side of a given issue, it is really unimportant who wins, as long as truth wins. But the disinfo artist will seek to emotionalize and chastise any failure (real or false claims thereof), and will seek by means of intimidation to prevent discussion in general.
It is the disinfo artist and those who may pull their strings (those who stand to suffer should the crime be solved) MUST seek to prevent rational and complete examination of any chain ofevidence which would hang them. Since fact and truth seldom fall on their own, they must be overcome with lies and deceit. Those who are professional in the art of lies and deceit, such as the intelligence community and the professional criminal (often the same people or at least working together), tend to apply fairly well defined and observable tools in this process.However, the public at large is not well armed against such weapons, and is often easily ledastray by these time-proven tactics. Remarkably, not even media and law enforcement have
NOT BEEN TRAINED to deal with these issues. For the most part, only the players themselves understand the rules of the game.
For such disinformationalists, the overall aim is to avoid discussing links in the chain of evidence which cannot be broken by truth, but at all times, to use clever deceptions or lies to make select links seem weaker than they are, create the illusion of a break, or better still, cause any who are considering the chain to be distracted in any number of ways, including the method of questioning the credentials of the presenter. Please understand that fact is fact, regardless of the source. Likewise, truth is truth, regardless of the source. This is why criminals are allowed to testify against other criminals. Where a motive to lie may truly exist, only actual evidence that the testimony itself IS a lie renders it completely invalid. Were a known 'liar's' testimony to stand on its own without supporting fact, it might certainly be of questionable value, but if the testimony (argument) is based on verifiable or otherwise demonstrable facts, it matters not who does the presenting or what their motives are, or if they have lied in the past or even if motivated to lie in this instance -- the facts or links would and should stand or fall on their own merit and their part in the matter will merely be supportive.

Moreover, particularly with respects to public forums such as newspaper letters to the editor, and Internet chat and news groups, the disinfo type has a very important role. In these forums, the principle topics of discussion are generally attempts by individuals to cause other persons to become interested in their own particular position, idea, or solution -- very much in development at the time. People often use such mediums as a sounding board and in hopes of pollination to better form their ideas. Where such ideas are critical of government or powerful, vested groups (especially if their criminality is the topic), the disinfo artist has yet another role -- the role of nipping it in the bud. They also seek to stage the concept, the presenter, and any supporters as less than credible should any possible future confrontation in more public forums result due to their early successes. You can often spot the disinfo types at work here by the unique application of "higher standards" of discussion than necessarily warranted. They will demand that those presenting arguments or concepts back everything up with the same level of expertise as a professor, researcher, or investigative writer. Anything less renders anydiscussion meaningless and unworthy in their opinion, and anyone who disagrees is obviously stupid -- and they generally put it in exactly those terms.

So, as you read any such discussions, particularly so in Internet news groups (NG), decide for yourself when a rational argument is being applied and when disinformation, psyops (psychological warfare operations) or trickery is the tool. Accuse those guilty of the latter freely. They (both those deliberately seeking to lead you astray, and those who are simply foolish or misguided thinkers) generally run for cover when thus illuminated, or -- put in other terms, they put up or shut up (a perfectly acceptable outcome either way, since truth is the goal.) Here are the twenty-five methods and seven traits, some of which don't apply directly to NG application. Each contains a simple example in the form of actual (some paraphrased for simplicity) from NG comments on commonly known historical events, and a proper response.[examples & response- proparanoid.com (http://www.proparanoid.com/truth.html)]
Accusations should not be overused -- reserve for repeat offenders and those who use multiple tactics. Responses should avoid falling into emotional traps or informational sidetracks, unless it is feared that some observers will be easily dissuaded by the trickery. Consider quoting the complete rule rather than simply citing it, as others will not have reference. Offer to provide a complete copy of the rule set upon request (see permissions statement at end):


Twenty-Five Rules of Disinformation

Note: The first rule and last five (or six, depending on situation) rules are generally not directly within the ability of the traditional disinfo artist to apply. These rules are generally used more directly by those at the leadership, key players, or planning level of the criminal conspiracy or conspiracy to cover up.

1. Hear no evil, see no evil, speak no evil. Regardless of what you know, don't discuss it -- especially if you are a public figure, news anchor, etc. If it's not reported, it didn't happen, and you never have to deal with the issues.
2. Become incredulous and indignant. Avoid discussing key issues and instead focus on side issues which can be used show the topic as being critical of some otherwise sacrosanct group or theme. This is also known as the 'How dare you!' gambit.
3. Create rumor mongers. Avoid discussing issues by describing all charges, regardless of venue or evidence, as mere rumors and wild accusations. Other derogatory terms mutually exclusive of truth may work as well. This method which works especially well with a silent press, because the only way the public can learn of the facts are through such 'arguable rumors'. If you can associate the material with the Internet, use this fact to certify it a 'wild rumor' from a 'bunch of kids on the Internet' which can have no basis in fact.
4. Use a straw man. Find or create a seeming element of your opponent's argument which you can easily knock down to make yourself look good and the opponent to look bad. Either make up an issue you may safely imply exists based on your interpretation of the opponent/opponent arguments/situation, or select the weakest aspect of the weakest charges. Amplify their significance and destroy them in a way which appears to debunk all the charges, real and fabricated alike, while actually avoiding discussion of the real issues.
5. Sidetrack opponents with name calling and ridicule. This is also known as the primary 'attack the messenger' ploy, though other methods qualify as variants of that approach. Associate opponents with unpopular titles such as 'kooks', 'right-wing', 'liberal', 'left-wing', 'terrorists', 'conspiracy buffs', 'radicals', 'militia', 'racists', 'religious fanatics', 'sexual deviates', and so forth. This makes others shrink from support out of fear of gaining the same label, and you avoid dealing with issues.
6. Hit and Run. In any public forum, make a brief attack of your opponent or the opponent position and then scamper off before an answer can be fielded, or simply ignore any answer. This works extremely well in Internet and letters-to-the-editor environments where a steady stream of new identities can be called upon without having to explain criticism, reasoning -- simply make an accusation or other attack, never discussing issues, and never answering any subsequent response, for that would dignify the opponent's viewpoint.
7. Question motives. Twist or amplify any fact which could be taken to imply that the opponent operates out of a hidden personal agenda or other bias. This avoids discussing issues and forces the accuser on the defensive.
8. Invoke authority. Claim for yourself or associate yourself with authority and present your argument with enough 'jargon' and 'minutia' to illustrate you are 'one who knows', and simply say it isn't so without discussing issues or demonstrating concretely why or citing sources.
9. Play Dumb. No matter what evidence or logical argument is offered, avoid discussing issues except with denials they have any credibility, make any sense, provide any proof, contain or make a point, have logic, or support a conclusion. Mix well for maximum effect.
10. Associate opponent charges with old news. A derivative of the straw man -- usually, in any large-scale matter of high visibility, someone will make charges early on which can be or were already easily dealt with - a kind of investment for the future should the matter not be so easily contained.) Where it can be foreseen, have your own side raise a straw man issue and have it dealt with early on as part of the initial contingency plans. Subsequent charges, regardless of validity or new ground uncovered, can usually then be associated with the original charge and dismissed as simply being a rehash without need to address current issues -- so much the better where the opponent is or was involved with the original source.
11. Establish and rely upon fall-back positions. Using a minor matter or element of the facts, take the 'high road' and 'confess' with candor that some innocent mistake, in hindsight, was made -- but that opponents have seized on the opportunity to blow it all out of proportion and imply greater criminalities which, 'just isn't so.' Others can reinforce this on your behalf, later, and even publicly 'call for an end to the nonsense' because you have already 'done the right thing.' Done properly, this can garner sympathy and respect for 'coming clean' and 'owning up' to your mistakes without addressing more serious issues.
12. Enigmas have no solution. Drawing upon the overall umbrella of events surrounding the crime and the multitude of players and events, paint the entire affair as too complex to solve. This causes those otherwise following the matter to begin to lose interest more quickly without having to address the actual issues.
13. Alice in Wonderland Logic. Avoid discussion of the issues by reasoning backwards or with an apparent deductive logic
which forbears any actual material fact.
14. Demand complete solutions. Avoid the issues by requiring opponents to solve the crime at hand completely, a ploy which works best with issues qualifying for rule 10.
15. Fit the facts to alternate conclusions. This requires creative thinking unless the crime was planned with contingency conclusions in place.
16. Vanish evidence and witnesses. If it does not exist, it is not fact, and you won't have to address the issue.
17. Change the subject. Usually in connection with one of the other ploys listed here, find a way to side-track the discussion with abrasive or controversial comments in hopes of turning attention to a new, more manageable topic. This works especially well with companions who can 'argue' with you over the new topic and polarize the discussion arena in order to avoid discussing more key issues.
18. Emotionalize, Antagonize, and Goad Opponents. If you can't do anything else, chide and taunt your opponents and draw them into emotional responses which will tend to make them look foolish and overly motivated, and generally render their material somewhat less coherent. Not only will you avoid discussing the issues in the first instance, but even if their emotional response addresses the issue, you can further avoid the issues by then focusing on how 'sensitive they are to criticism.'
19. Ignore proof presented, demand impossible proofs. This is perhaps a variant of the 'play dumb' rule. Regardless of what material may be presented by an opponent in public forums, claim the material irrelevant and demand proof that is impossible for the opponent to come by (it may exist, but not be at his disposal, or it may be something which is known to be safely destroyed or withheld, such as a murder weapon.) In order to completely avoid discussing issues, it may be required that you to categorically deny and be critical of media or books as valid sources, deny that witnesses are acceptable, or even deny that statements made by government or other authorities have any meaning or relevance.
20. False evidence. Whenever possible, introduce new facts or clues designed and manufactured to conflict with opponent presentations -- as useful tools to neutralize sensitive issues or impede resolution. This works best when the crime was designed
with contingencies for the purpose, and the facts cannot be easily separated from the fabrications.
21. Call a Grand Jury, Special Prosecutor, or other empowered investigative body. Subvert the (process) to your benefit and effectively neutralize all sensitive issues without open discussion. Once convened, the evidence and testimony are required to be secret when properly handled. For instance, if you own the prosecuting attorney, it can insure a Grand Jury hears no useful evidence and that the evidence is sealed and unavailable to subsequent investigators. Once a favorable verdict is achieved, the matter can be considered officially closed. Usually, this technique is applied to find the guilty innocent, but it can also be used to obtain charges when seeking to frame a victim.
22. Manufacture a new truth. Create your own expert(s), group(s), author(s), leader(s) or influence existing ones willing to forge new ground via scientific, investigative, or social research or testimony which concludes favorably. In this way, if you must actually address issues, you can do so authoritatively.
23. Create bigger distractions. If the above does not seem to be working to distract from sensitive issues, or to prevent unwanted media coverage of unstoppable events such as trials, create bigger news stories (or treat them as such) to distract the multitudes.
24. Silence critics. If the above methods do not prevail, consider removing opponents from circulation by some definitive solution so that the need to address issues is removed entirely. This can be by their death, arrest and detention, blackmail or destruction of theircharacter by release of blackmail information, or merely by destroying them financially, emotionally, or severely damaging their health.
25. Vanish. If you are a key holder of secrets or otherwise overly illuminated and you think the heat is getting too hot, to avoid the issues, vacate the kitchen. .

KSigMason
12-29-2010, 06:02 AM
All the experts agree, Freemasonry is bad.

http://www.topnews.in/files/adolf-hitler.jpghttp://www.novascotiascott.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/stalin2.jpghttp://beyondrace.com/images/stories/saddam-hussein.jpghttp://www.stopahmadinejad.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/06/hamas-gaza-body-parts-02.jpg

KSigMason
12-29-2010, 06:07 AM
Anti-Masonic Tactics:

The motives of anti-Masons are sometimes blatantly obvious. Hawking books, audio and video tapes, and CDs they use breathless prose to extol the the 'truth' that you can get from them. Invoking God and/or some immediately pending cataclysmic catastrophe, it never seems to fail that their hands are always out for donations as well as article sales.
Invariably too, there's an 'appeal to authority'. A supposedly 'top leader' of Freemasonry is quoted ~ perhaps using just a few words ~ to somehow prove beyond any doubt that the lurid premise is completely proven. It is supremely ironic, of course, that they never refer to the MANY other things that the individual may have written since to do so would completely contradict the picture the anti-Mason tries to paint. Even Masonic authors who have said in clear and unequivocal terms what they really believe are quoted out of context in the hopes that the unknowing and unwary will be swayed by the strange-sounding titles and the intermingling of casually-related phrases. Sometimes it's the use of a book published by an anti-Masonic 'vanity' publisher or sometimes they'll claim that writings against Masons or Masonry cannot be published by 'legitimate' publishers because they're all Masonically-controlled.
In some cases, these purveyors of lies hide behind real or imagined paranoia claiming that the truth cannot be fully told for fear of retribution of some kind.
And sometimes, they believe that God has spoken to them directly and told them to destroy the Freemasons - as if God is somehow incapable of doing such things without their assistance!
In this section, we talk about those who're visible in their anti-Masonic activities (i.e., not hiding behind some on-line identity which changes frequently). We also provide a review of some internal inconsistencies in their arguments and offer some of our thoughts on responding to 'antis'. You can reach these various sections by clicking on their respective buttons on the right. In addition, we've got a quick summary of some of the more egregious activities of anti-Masons over the centuries.
http://www.masonicinfo.com/_themes/minfo/barcline.gif
The repertoire of techniques is varied but most involve simple deceit. Common tactics are listed below. Click on each method for more information about how it is used.



Change the Subject
Guilt by Association
Using Different Standards
If your were...
Refuse to Answer
Outright Lies
Oft-Repeated Falsehoods
Quibble over Semantics
Faulty Logic
Assumptive Positions
Prove It
Straw Man

KSigMason
12-29-2010, 06:26 AM
Objections to Freemasonry:

Freemasonry is the world's oldest and largest Fraternity. While its traditions look back earlier, Masonry in its current form appeared when its public events were noticed by the residents of London, England in 1717. Although Masonry, particularly in its earliest days, had elements of secrecy, the first 'exposure' of the supposedly highly-secret Masonic ritual actually appeared in 1696 - twenty one years BEFORE the founding of the first Grand Lodge nearly three hundred years ago.

That exposure marked the beginning of (now) more than 300 years of objections to the organization. Why? There are, surely, many causes: jealousy, fear of the unknown, superstition, bigotry, or a dozen more. The objections can be generally grouped into three categories and clicking on the hyperlinks below will bring you to additional pages which amplify what charges are being (or have been) made:

Religious A number of people object to Freemasonry (often quite vocally) on a religious basis, claiming that Masonry is a religion, supplants their religion or is not 'the way to {their idea of} Heaven'. In addition, many religious leaders with 'marginal' credentials (a degree received by mail from a non-accredited religious school, for example) need to create other 'areas of interest' to provide their congregations with fodder for inquiry thereby never giving them time to critically consider the shaky theological background of their leader. The major causes of the world's hurts (famine, war, etc.) are simply too amorphous and could cause dissent. Focusing on what they define as a 'false religion' allows them to bring their flock together against a common and easily identifiable enemy. Finally, Freemasonry encourages toleration - something that dictators of nations and of local church groups particularly fear.
Examples (http://www.masonicinfo.com/religious_objections.htm)


Social Some object to Freemasonry on social grounds arguing that it is creating or part of a 'New World Order' - even if they can't provide a single scintilla of proof. The 'boogey-man' is always a convenient enemy. They'll argue too that Freemasonry is related to the Ku Klux Klan, that it protects its own members, or that it demands secrecy even to the point of murdering violators - again without tangible proof. These broad and often ambiguous claims shift and turn, never providing a single specific target against which responses can be mustered.
Examples (http://www.masonicinfo.com/social_objections.htm)

Other
There are miscellaneous other objections, including objections to the supposed foolishness of Masonic rituals and secrecy. When the larger issues are insufficient to prove a point - or when someone is desperate for attention, they use 'proof by verbosity', tossing in all sorts of snarky comments about "rolled-up trouser legs" etc. Anything at all to 'divert the discourse'....

Examples (http://www.masonicinfo.com/other_objections.htm)

SOURCE (http://www.masonicinfo.com/objections.htm)

JBoy
12-29-2010, 07:04 AM
Baal is a Judeo-Christian demon. In the Masonic Royal Arch Degree ritual (13th degree in the Scottish Rite) the sacred god of Freemasonry is revealed as Jah-Bal-On or Jahbuhlun. BUL = Baal, so the world is run by BAAL

http://www.whale.to/b/Bael.jpg
The demon Bael, from Collin de Plancy's Dictionnaire infernal (1862)

JBoy
12-29-2010, 07:17 AM
JAH-BUL-ON
by Stephen Knight (http://www.whale.to/b/knight_h.html)
(The Brotherhood by Stephen Knight p. 236-240)
In the ritual of exaltation, the name of the Great Architect of the Universe is revealed as JAH-BUL-ON -not a general umbrella term open to any interpretation an individual Freemason might choose, but a precise designation that describes a specific supernatural being - a compound deity composed of three separate personalities fused in one. Each syllable of the 'ineffable name' represents one personality of this Trinity:
JAH = Jahweh, the God of the Hebrews.
BUL = Baal, the ancient Canaanite fertility god associated with 'licentious rites of imitative magic'.
ON = Osiris, the Ancient Egyptian god of the underworld.
Baal, of course, was the 'false god' with whom Jahweh competed for the allegiance of the Israelites in the Old Testament. But more recently, within a hundred years of the creation of the Freemason's God, the sixteenth-century demonologist John Weir identified Baal (http://www.whale.to/b/baal_h.html) as a devil. This grotesque manifestation of evil had the body of a spider and three heads - those of a man, a toad and a cat. A description of Baal to be found in de Plancy's Dictionary of Witchcraft is particularly apposite when considered in the light of the secretive and deceptive nature of Freemasonry: his voice was raucous, and he taught his followers guile, cunning and the ability to become invisible.
In 1873, the renowned masonic author and historian General Albert Pike, later to become Grand Commander of the Southern Jurisdiction of the Supreme Council (of the 33rd Degree) at Charleston, USA, wrote of his reaction on learning of Jah-Bul-On. He was disquieted and disgusted by the name, and went on: 'No man or body of men can make me accept as a sacred word, as a symbol of the infinite and eternal Godhead, a mongrel word, in part composed of the name of an accursed and beastly heathen god, whose name has been for more than two thousand years an appellation of the Devil.'
I have spoken to no less than fifty-seven long-standing Royal Arch Freemasons who have been happy to talk to me, to help me in my ambition to give Freemasonry 'a fair crack of the whip'. Most of them spoke quite freely, explaining without hesitation their views, reactions and answers to the criticisms and queries I raised. However, all but four lost their self-assurance and composure when I said, 'What about Jah-Bul-On?' Some, although they had previously told me they had been exalted to the Royal Arch, and therefore must have not only received the lecture on the name but also studied the passages and enacted the ritual relating to Jah-Bul-On, said they had never heard of it. In most cases the interviewees very rapidly brought the meeting to a close when I asked the question. Others laughed unconvincingly and extricated themselves from having to reply by jauntily saying such words as, 'Oh, that old chestnut', and passing quickly on to some other subject, normally going on the offensive with something like, 'Why are you so interested in Freemasonry in particular? Why don't you look into Christianity or something? Why do people always pick on Freemasonry?' -thereby diverting the conversation from the course I had plotted. If I insisted on returning to Jah-Bul-On, almost invariably the interview would be unceremoniously terminated. Others said that although they had heard of the word, they did not know what it meant. To them it meant God, and previously erudite Freemasons, with a precise knowledge of every other aspect of Masonry we had discussed, suddenly became vague and claimed ignorance of this most central of all Freemasonic subjects. While professing an almost total lack of knowledge of Jah-Bul-On, several dismissed it as of no real importance.
Charles Stratton, one Royal Arch Freemason for whom I have the utmost admiration, told me this of Jah-Bul-On: 'No one ever has time to think about its meaning, you're too busy trying to remember your words. As far as I know it's just another name for Jehovah.'
Acute silences, chiefly of embarrassment, followed my question on many occasions, as happened when I spoke to a most co-operative officer both of Grand Lodge and Grand Chapter.
We had been discussing whether or not Freemasonry was a religion, and I had run through my customary list of religious terms used in Freemasonry. Then I added, 'One comes across the phrase, "the sacred tenets of Free*masonry". This seems to imply that Masonry thinks of itself as a religion.'
The Grand Officer replied, 'No, I haven't said that. .. the sacred tenets?'
'Yes.'
'Well, the word sacred means holy.'
'Yes. Then there's the "Holy" Royal Arch.'
He paused. When he began to speak again it was much more slowly.
'Yes. The Holy Royal Arch. They are all expressions of ... religion in its fullest sense, not in a masonic sense. I cannot stress too strongly the fact that there is no masonic religion, no masonic god, deity or someone or something to which a Freemason must swear loyalty. No.'
'What about Jah-Bul-On?'
He was obviously taken off-guard. He said nothing for nearly ten seconds and looked most discomfited. At length, proceeding with the extreme caution of a man feeling his way through a thicket of thorns, he said: 'These are ... Hebrew words which are ... murdered from their original. And Jah is the Hebrew word for God, so it's God again. You come back to God, the real God. But these - ha! [he chuckled] - these are ways in which we express our loyalty to God.'
'It's interesting you should choose only to define the first syllable, which is of course the most acceptable to those with religious convictions. But what about the other parts of that word which are, are they not, Baal and Osiris?'
Another long pause. 'I don't know them. That's the higher echelons of Freemasonry.'
'That's in the Royal Arch, isn't it?'
'I don't do Royal Arch. I do Chapter, but not Royal Arch.'
This was the first lie he had told me, and I could see it was unpleasant for him.
I continued: 'It is established that Jahbulon is a composite name for God, made up of Jah—'
'What's Bul-On?'
'Bul is Baal and On is Osiris, the Ancient Egyptian god of the dead.'
'Well...'
'Pike was outraged when he heard that name for the first time and saw it associated with Freemasonry, which of course was so dear to him. He said that nothing would induce him to accept as the name of God a word which is in part the name of a pagan god and for more than two thousand years an appellation of the devil.'
'I agree on that, but I... I... I don't know about it. It's not that I don't want to. I don't know about it so I really can't comment. You'll have to ask someone who knows.'
'Does it worry you?'
'In one of the higher degrees they use Jesus Christ.'
'Yes, there are several masonic orders which are exclusively Christian - the Knights Templar, the Ancient and Accepted Rite, the Societas Rosicruciana, the Knights of Malta, the Order of Eri. But does the name Jah-Bul-On worry you?'
'Many Masons wouldn't subscribe to those Christian degrees.'
The implication was clear: if Christ was an acceptable part of Freemasonry even to a non-Christian, why not the devil as well? Unacceptable though he might be to most initiates, he has his place.

JBoy
12-29-2010, 07:21 AM
Now, im positive u have NO brain THIS IS THE 15 TH TIME, I DONT WRITE THESE ARTICLES.. WHO ARE U RUNNING CIRCLES AROUND ? .. a magical knight LOL !!!:D.. lots of circles.. u truly belong a shriner tottler car with a clown suit, Ill buy it !! whats ur address !!!!
Who is Jaboulon ??? u creep !!!

KSigMason
12-29-2010, 07:41 AM
whats ur address !!!!
Who is Jaboulon ??? u creep !!!
My address is right there in my title information. But alas I don't think you'll come visit me.

You seem to think you know more, just keep posting your falsehoods.

JBoy
12-29-2010, 07:49 AM
http://www.whale.to/b/Bael.jpg
The demon Bael, from Collin de Plancy's Dictionnaire infernal (1862)

KSigMason
12-29-2010, 07:53 AM
That Collin guy had quite the imagination.

JBoy
12-29-2010, 08:09 AM
lets go back 2 000 yrs..let ur mind wonder, who is on the rock about to get his head chopped off. and who is the one doing the chopping ????
http://www.whale.to/b/OT-096-med.jpg

KSigMason
12-29-2010, 08:27 AM
Suddenly I feel like I'm back in Bible Study class.

JBoy
12-29-2010, 03:15 PM
PRESIDENT Truman.....Puppet Mason

November 30, 2010 by POPEYE (http://www.federaljack.com/?author=7)

B’nai B’rith – The Jewish Secret Society that Dominates America


Secret Societies : Federal Jack (http://www.federaljack.com/?tag=secret-societies)



November 26, 2009 by POPEYE (http://www.federaljack.com/?author=7)
Filed under Secret Societies (http://www.federaljack.com/?cat=62)

7 Comments (http://www.federaljack.com/?p=12917#comments)


(FOUR WINDS) B’nai B’rith was instrumental in gaining U.S. support for the nascent Zionist state of Israel in the late 1940s. The Jewish secret society of Freemasons used President Harry Truman’s friend – and their agent – Eddie Jacobson of Kansas City (standing behind Truman) in off-the-record meetings in the Oval Office to persuade the president to approve the Zionist land grab known as the 1947 U.N. Partition Plan of Palestine and then to recognize the state of Israel the next year following the Zionist ethnic cleansing of nearly 400 Palestinian villages and towns. By applying pressure directly on Truman, B’nai B’rith dictated U.S. policy in spite of strong resistance from the U.S. Department of State. When Truman extended de jurerecognition of the Zionist state on January 31, 1949, the only guests invited to the signing ceremony in the Oval Office were members of B’nai B’rith: Eddie Jacobson, the B’nai B’rith executive vice president Maurice Bisgyer, and the secret society’s president, Frank Goldman
President Truman, a highest level Freemason, was forced to accept the dictates of a gang of Zionist Jewish Freemasons on crafting U.S. policy in the Middle East. What does this say about the real hierarchy of power among Freemasons? Truman, a Freemason since 1909, had established the Grandview Lodge No. 618 in Missouri and served as its first “Worshipful Master”. In 1940, Brother Truman was elected the ninety-seventh Grand Master of Masons of Missouri. In 1945, President Truman was made a Sovereign Grand Inspector General, 33°, and Honorary Member at the Supreme Council of the Ancient & Accepted Scottish Rite (A.A.S.R.) Southern Jurisdiction Headquarters in Washington D.C. The fact that Jewish Freemasons of the B’nai B’rith were able to meet secretly with the president in the Oval Office whenever they wanted and were able to direct the U.S. president, a highest level Mason, to follow their orders in shaping U.S. policy in the Middle East, shows the immense power this secret society of Zionist Jews has long had over the U.S. government and other Masonic orders. Barack Hussein Obama was cultivated as a politician in Chicago and made President of the United States by the power of the B’nai B’rith. It’s high time for these secret societies to be removed from the corridors of power where U.S. policy is crafted.

http://www.bollyn.com/public/harry_s_truman_pgm_missouri_1.jpg

JBoy
12-29-2010, 03:21 PM
That Collin guy had quite the imagination.



Colllin is the dictionary.. what does that have to do with Masons ????
this is a mason god. yes or no.. Collin did not invent that...nor did collin draw that.. what is ur point..

JBoy
12-29-2010, 03:27 PM
Eisenhower was a jewish Freemason.. he murdered over 1 million germans after the peace treaty was signed...ALL over the internet.. go prove for ur self... faker. I have the story here posted. U look up and disprove
FREEMASONS EVIL>>>>MURDERS innocent Germans. Of the over million that were killed, many were children and women.. Truman just as blame..
Patton would never do that .He was a true american..

JBoy
12-29-2010, 03:31 PM
BONES (http://www.federaljack.com/?tag=skull-and-bones), US News (http://www.federaljack.com/?tag=us-news), WORLD NEWS (http://www.federaljack.com/?tag=world-news) Boy Scouts — Model of Masonic Subversion? (http://www.federaljack.com/?p=10447)

August 24, 2009 by POPEYE (http://www.federaljack.com/?author=7)
Filed under Secret Societies (http://www.federaljack.com/?cat=62)

Leave a Comment (http://www.federaljack.com/?p=10447#respond)


http://www.henrymakow.com/scouting.jpgby Henry Makow Ph.D.

The Boy Scouts of America is rare among major institutions in banning homosexuals, atheists and agnostics as leaders. In a decadent age, the BSA is unique in upholding God, country and traditional values.
With 1.6 million members& 470,000 leaders in 50,000 packs, it appears to be an incredible force for good. But how many genuine forces for good are there in this world?
Like most major institutions, the Boy Scouts appears to have been subverted by Freemasonry, which has ah (http://www.henrymakow.com/_left_albert_pike_1809-1891by.html)idden agenda of promoting homosexuality (http://www.henrymakow.com/_left_albert_pike_1809-1891by.html) and denying God.
(Freemasonry is empowered by cabalist central banking families who wish to redefine reality and hijack mankind. Evidence of their power is the modern discomfort with using the term “God” which denotes the natural and moral order, truth and ultimate reality.)
Scouting’s national honor society “recognizing Boy Scouts who best exemplify the Scout Oath and Law in their daily lives” is a Masonic secret society called the“Order of the Arrow.” (http://oa-bsa.org/) It has more than 180,000 members in “lodges” affiliated with more than 300 BSA local councils.
The Boy Scouts must ensure that their commendable work does not provide cover & recruits for the Masonic agenda.
First, let’s look at the commendable goals. The BSA web site proclaims: (http://www.bsalegal.org/faqs-195.asp) “That Boy Scouts also has traditional values, like requiring youth to do their “duty to God” and be “morally straight” is nothing to be ashamed of and should not be controversial. No court case has ever held that Boy Scouts discriminate unlawfully, and it is unfortunate here that anyone would characterize Boy Scouts’ constitutionally protected right to hold traditional values as ‘discriminatory.’ That is just name-calling.”
The “Scout Law” teaches youths to be “trustworthy, loyal, helpful, friendly, courteous, kind, obedient, cheerful, thrifty, brave, clean, and reverent.”
It defines God as “the ruling and leading power in the universe” to whom we are grateful for “favors and blessings.” It maintains that “Boy Scouts believe that homosexual conduct is not compatible with the aims and purposes of Scouting and that a known or avowed homosexual does not present a desirable role model for the youth in the Scouting program.”
TOO GOOD TO BE TRUE?
These are brave words for an organization that was probably founded by a homosexual to “scout” fresh talent for the British Empire’s pedophile elite.
The homosexual inclinations of Scout Founder Robert Baden Powell (1857-1941) have been noted by two recent biographers. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexuality_of_Robert_Baden-Powell) He liked being with young boys, especially if they were skinny dipping.
Although married with three children, he was probably a homosexual. His father died (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baden_Powell) when he was three-years-old. Subsequently, Robert was raised by his mother, “a strong woman who was determined that her children would succeed.” Baden-Powell would say of her in 1933 “The whole secret of my getting on, lay with my mother.”
http://www.henrymakow.com/225px-Baden_Powell.jpgAlthough some Freemasons deny he was a member, lodges as far away as South Africa, Australia and New Zealand are named in his honor. He rose to the rank of Lieutenant General and fought with distinction in Britain’s colonial wars subduing Zulus and Boers. His cohorts, from Lord Kitchener to King Edward VII were homosexuals, Freemasons and debauchees.
His gravestone bears a circle with a dot in the center, which is the trail sign for “Going home”, or “I have gone home.” This is also a symbol of the Illuminati, representing penis and vagina.
THE ORDER OF THE ARROW

Lucifer recruits mankind using a combination of deception and seduction. Freemasonry is the Church of Lucifer, which is the real “religion” of (post-Enlightenment) Western “civilization.” It operates under many banners: Liberalism, Socialism, Zionism, Communism, Fascism, Feminism and “gay rights.”
Like all of the above, Freemasonry is a secret society, i.e. the membership is deceived as to the true agenda. The lower three “Blue Degrees” are fed platitudes about charity and making good men better. But, in reality, only the corruptible advance. Our whole society is based on this model which explains why our leaders, both political and cultural, have abandoned us.
Thus, it is quite likely that the Boy Scouts of America represent the innocent Blue Degrees. It is possible that “The Order of the Arrow” represents a recruitment pool for Freemasonry and ultimately other things.
John Salza is a former 32 degree Freemason and the author of the book “Freemasonry Unmasked.” (http://www.nicenetruth.com/home/2008/10/masonry-unmaske.html) He has written an essay (http://www.nicenetruth.com/home/2009/08/freemasonry-has-infiltrated-the-boy-scouts.html)about the OA entitled “Freemasonry has Infiltrated the Boy Scouts.” The OA was founded in 1915 by two 32 degree Freemasons and its rituals are patterned on Masonic rituals. Both have three degrees; both are organized into lodges, both rituals seek esoteric spiritual knowledge and illumination. Candidates are conducted around the lodge while bound by a rope.
Salza writes:”These rituals–which include a blood covenant are being conferred upon innocent boy scouts…and are harming their souls. [This information] comes from a scout who has experienced demonic spiritual manifestations after his initiation into OA.”
America’s youths are being inducted into an occult secret society by stealth means. Scouts and Masons will deny there is anything wrong but this only proves their gullibility and venality. The BSA is doing the exact opposite of what it claims.
CONCLUSION
What is happening in the Boy Scouts is happening is society at large. Churches (http://www.onenewsnow.com/Church/Default.aspx?id=654508), political parties, the YMCA, the media, schools –no institution is immune.
Mankind is satanically possessed, and is being inducted into a satanic cult through sex, violence, money, drugs, secret societies or media-induced panic or psychosis. Movies today are mostly mindless killing and mayhem, apocalyptic catastrophe and pornographic sadism.
The Illuminati (the highest rung of Cabalistic Freemasonry) intends to degrade mankind and deliver us to Lucifer as Tribute. This is what they mean by “change.” They spit in the face of God and much of mankind seems only too willing to go along.
http://www.henrymakow.com/boy_scouts_–_example_of_mason.html (http://www.henrymakow.com/boy_scouts_--_example_of_mason.html)



U SAID NO PHDS SPEAK OF FREEMASONRY..

email Mr.Makow. he would be glad to debate a glorious battle. go...

JBoy
12-29-2010, 03:36 PM
Suddenly I feel like I'm back in Bible Study class.


Point. They slaughterd ur ass back then,, it could happen again...

KSigMason
12-30-2010, 05:45 AM
In response to the first blog post, I take great offense to being called a secret society and more particularly, a Jewish one, as I am a Christian, and Freemasonry doesn't hold hold any religion above another. Every member must worship in his own way. Also, B’nai B’rith isn't a part of the Masonic family nor is it a superior hierarchy.

Barack Obama is not a Freemason.

Colllin is the dictionary.. what does that have to do with Masons ????
this is a mason god. yes or no.. Collin did not invent that...nor did collin draw that.. what is ur point..
So who drew it? When was it drawn?

Eisenhower was a jewish Freemason.. he murdered over 1 million germans after the peace treaty was signed...ALL over the internet.. go prove for ur self... faker. I have the story here posted. U look up and disprove
FREEMASONS EVIL>>>>MURDERS innocent Germans. Of the over million that were killed, many were children and women.. Truman just as blame..
Patton would never do that .He was a true american..
Strange that even the Germans don't seem to recall missing 1 Million people. I'm not going to read on another one of your stupid sites. If you don't want to post it that's fine, but your word means very little, as well as people like you...nutcases.

To the Boy Scout blog post, Freemasons don't promote homosexuality and we do not deny God. Politics is definitely not allowed to be discussed within the Lodge. We are made up of members of various beliefs and so for the Lodge to take up sides would cause discord among the Brethren.

I was a Boy Scout and I agree wholeheartedly with the values they teach. That is a proposterous and slanderous thing to say about the founder, Lord Baden Powell. There are Lodges named after him because of the good he did. You don't have to be a member to have a Lodge named after you.

Freemasonry is actually fairly conservative due to its requirement to be religious and, IMO, most liberals don't believe in any god or hold any religious beliefs. Its ironic that this moron tries to say Freemasonry is connected to the fascist despots of history, when in reality they were victims of their oppression and aggression.

By using logic, non-Masons are lower on the tier of knowledge than they are as they are actual members. Unless the blogger is so arrogant that he believes he is better informed than actual members. He also assumes too much as most members do research before joining.

He also assumes too much on people's souls. He is not God, nor can he define one's relationship with God. One can spew words, but its what is in their heart that matters.

And Popeye is random blogger, not a journalist.

I've done my research, I've prayed and done soul searching, and I've observed many things; Freemasonry isn't evil. So many anti-Masons are so filled with hate, I would never want to associate with them or any organization they belong to.

KSigMason
12-30-2010, 05:47 AM
Point. They slaughterd ur ass back then,, it could happen again...
Yeah, you're going to come slaughter us? Round us up and jail us? In today's world, never. We have freedom, something you oppose. Your thought process would take us back to religious oppression and the dark ages.

JBoy
12-30-2010, 03:06 PM
Yeah, you're going to come slaughter us? Round us up and jail us? In today's world, never. We have freedom, something you oppose. Your thought process would take us back to religious oppression and the dark ages.


JABAULON will ?????

Chaser Tiponi
04-28-2011, 06:17 PM
Evil? No, far from it.

The idea of Mason being evil, in with the devil, comes from christianity. To find a silly excuse to close down these freethinkers, they made people belive they were in with the devil.

Most masonic temples have tours, go on one. You wont be able to see everything, but pretty much every room is covered.

No windows? Well, look around. How many temples have windows? How many churches have windows? By that, I mean windows you can look inside without risking braking your neck. Windows are high up etc. etc. There is also the mystical aspect of it, and keeping the rituals a secret etc. etc. Most rituals are today well known, so there is really no secrets.

The masonic orders have no religion, even if the have both the bible and the koran. Most places have a prayer room, were these book lay repectfully, and were those who feel like prayer can do so. Except from that, I know that some use the bible to swear to uphold the brotherhood.

I would argue that freemasonic teaching is religion, maybe one of the better, but with a strong focus on characterbuilding. You learn to respect all sorts of people, you feel welcomed in a group and you learn respect of symbolic rituals. The rituals themselfs are there to read as you want, they dont have one simple meaning and no preacher fill your head with dogmas. And there is the difference of masons and other religions, no dogmas.

The pentagram? Well, what is the pentagram but a christian invention. Lucifer is older then christianity, meaning light bearer or son of dawn. In Roman astrology its Venus, the morning star, shining brightest before the sun rises. What is the sun? It is God, and they just had to trow Lucifer out of the sky to make room for "thau shalt not have more then bla bla bla".

If there is something smelly and shadowy about it, its christianity with its history. Even Hitler chased down the masons, and many ended their life in prison camps. At worst its a boysclub, that sometimes can be used for the wrong things, like using your "brother" for private interests and such. It used to be big amongst the powers that be, politicans and such, but have lost its spunk over the years. But dont come and tell me that priests, good christians, muslims, hindu or what ever never spun webs for their own good?

Yes, the freemasons originally were formed to escape the tyranny and forced slavery of the Christians. Christianity and the bible itself were created (in my opinion) to control the masses. It has since turned into the misconceptions perceived by so many in modern times.

Christianity uses it's churches and clergy to convince people not to compare their bible and other literature that they produce to other facts that are available in the world today for research.

This in my opinion is why the Vatican library was closed for 3 years between 2007-2010. It just doesn't take 3 years to install air conditioning as they claim as their reasoning. It takes 3 years to rewrite records. Something that has become increasingly important for them as more and more people have gained access to the internet.

Christians and Protestants alike are followers of years of lies and deceit designed to take their money and control their thinking.

What was originally the "Masons" was a revolt. The revolutionists called themselves "Freemasons" but originally they were slaves to Christianity. They formed the Freemasons to escape that tyranny.

JustTheTruth920
06-08-2011, 08:23 PM
I believe that authentic Christianity and Freemasonry are in opposition to each other. One big red flag was the forbidding of praying in the name of Jesus Christ. This is a commandment that we should pray to the Father in the name of Jesus Christ, whose name is above any other name.

Our Bible says that if we deny the Son of God and all of who He is which is God (the Living God) incarnate or in the form of man. For non-Christians there is no problem because they do not accept what Christ has done for them. But for a believer, to deny who Christ is and to pray and omit the in the name of Jesus is in opposition to what the Bible teaches.

Freemasonry teaches that all of the God's of the different religions in the world are basically the same God. So Christian, Muslim, Buddist or even Satanist strictly speaking would be essentially worshiping the same God. True enough all of the other religions are worshiping the same god, the god of this world, but Christians are praying to the One True and Living God.

Freemasonry teaches that there are certain principles to follow like Hiram Abiff, to reach the Great White throne and enter heaven. By good works and charity. This is opposite from what an authentic Christian believes. A Christian believes that he is privileged to enter heaven for one reason and one reason alone. That is that God in the form of man Jesus Christ paid the penalty once and for all and is the door and THE Way to heaven, that no man will enter except by faith in his finished work. Christians know that good works come from a changed life, not as a way to attain heaven.

Christian pastors have no business involving themselves in secretive and exclusive fraternities, that reject a man with a disability. Jesus spent most of his time on earth with the poor, the sick, the disenfranchised. Everything He did was in the open for all to see. He never spoke of there being any other way to heaven except through Him.

There have been enough ex-masons give testimonies on John Ankerberg and other places who have told enough to make any listening Christian who has been deceived about the true nature of the doctrines of Freemasonry and be seduced by the prideful names and titles they can attain. The praise of mere men becomes more important than pleasing God.

The Bible clearly states that Christians should not take oaths but let their yes be yes and their no be no. These terrible blood oaths taken are Satanic in nature.

I am only talking about Christians, unbelievers are in their element until they come to Christ and they live as their unregenerate hearts tell them to, but a true believer is acting against the Holy Spirit who now lives in them. Due to ignorance or simply that they are only religious and not true born again Christians.

JustTheTruth920
06-08-2011, 08:31 PM
I am amazed that you paint Protestant churches as you do. All giving in my church is voluntary. I understand that to be a Mason you have to pay your dues. So what is that but an organization to suck money out of unsuspecting and uninformed people. The pride of life is the reason it is so seductive.
Anyone at anytime can freely come into a church and know all that is said. There is no other requirement than that you open the door and walk in. Their is no requirement that you even believe. There is certainly no requirement that you put anything in the offering plate. And there is no restriction based on gender, or physical fitness. There is a world of difference between authentic Christianity and what you are saying.

KSigMason
06-08-2011, 09:25 PM
Well, I wish I would have read this earlier, but alas I'm going to bed now. I'll be back on later.

Ironically I just finished a book called, "Workman Unashamed" and he refutes the many claims against Freemasonry and the intolerants claim that it is incompatible with Christianity (which it is not).

JustTheTruth920
06-09-2011, 02:07 PM
Because there have been brave men and women from the Eastern Star, Rainbow type groups who have come out of it and told the truth about it. It isn't really a secret because the secrets have been revealed. It is obviously a very devil inspired organization to deceive and seduce men by the pride of exclusiveness, and the silly exalted degrees and titles. As the Bible has said those things which were hidden will be shouted from the housetops. Lucifer is the father of lies so what surprise is it that members who are deceived will do the works of the orchestrator. Lies are part and parcel of the Freemasonry labyrinth. Pride and fear hold men captive. It is evil to the core. Good men may be deceived, but eventually people who want truth will come out of it.

JustTheTruth920
06-09-2011, 02:21 PM
Many Christians and mostly Jews were also killed in concentration camps.

JustTheTruth920
06-09-2011, 02:26 PM
If you call doing charity for kids and making good men into better men evil, then something is totally wrong here.

I hope you don't think that giving to charity is exclusive to Masons? And the "good men" I have seen turn out to be self-centered arrogant and prideful about being a Mason. Don't see how "pride" which is one of Satan's calling cards, is making good men into better men. It is only a slogan with no real substance to it.

JustTheTruth920
06-09-2011, 02:54 PM
What possible thing excellent to the Bible does any Christian need to read to find out what living a life for Christ is? As I understand it, the name of Jesus Christ is not allowed in the Lodge meetings. As there is no other Name higher this is a big red flag as to the slow indoctrination to meld all gods into one. Allah is not the same God as the Lord God Almighty. All other religions worship a form of Satan. Authentic Christianity worships the One True God, and is the only "religion" with a Savior and a promise that that Savior is living and wants to live in believers by faith. That our salvation is not attained but received by Grace through faith. There is no need for a secret organization to tell born again Christians where to find the light. The Bible says as believers we have moved from the kingdom of darkness to the Kingdom of Light. So for a Christian to say I am in darkness is a lie. A lie that must be spoken to be initiated into the Masons. Christ did nothing in the dark, but out in the open. He healed the sick, raised the status of women, and spent most of his time with the poor and needy. His main enemies were people who felt they were earning heaven by their works. In fact it was this group that instigated his murder. However, God used the evil of their hearts to make a way for Salvation to ALL who would come to Him in faith in His Son Jesus Christ. To refuse to name the Name of Jesus Christ in any organization says a lot about the organization. No mature Christian would stay in such an organization. One that makes mere men's opinions more important than the opinion and will of Almighty God. There is no where in scripture that God is called by such a name. This man made name is not the name of God Almighty. The Bible says if you deny Jesus before men, then He will deny you before the Father. This is something that should bring conviction and reverential fear in the hearts of Christian men. So much so that they would disconnect themselves from such and organization.

JustTheTruth920
06-09-2011, 02:57 PM
Yes, exactly.

JustTheTruth920
06-09-2011, 03:22 PM
And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. 2 Corinthians 11:14

KSigMason
06-09-2011, 09:07 PM
The Bible also says that secrets are not bad either. I can cherry pick the Bible as well.

JustTheTruth920
06-09-2011, 09:46 PM
I wouldn't call myself an intolerant. I am speaking strictly to other Christians, an authentic Christian. Meaning a person who has believed by faith that Christ was the Only Begotten Son of God, born of a virgin, who lived a sinless life, was crucified in our place and rose on the third day from the dead, then ascended to heaven after 40 days. Who then sent His Holy Spirit to dwell in the hearts and be in union with the spirits of those who have accepted His sacrifice for them and asked Christ to come into their lives, forgive their sins and regenerate them, impute righteousness by grace as a free and unearned gift. Christian (in name only) doesn't count.
Those people who are genuine believers have no business in an organization who will not allow the name of Jesus mentioned in the lodge meetings, who teach that any man by following lodge teachings can attain heaven, and that men can save themselves through good works and charity. It is changing men who have been made new in Christ into men who confess that they are in darkness even though the Bible declares that a true Christian has moved from the Kingdom of Darkness into the Kingdom of Light. The Light, the true light is already in them. The symbolism in being hoodwinked is appropriate, because men are blindly making oaths without really thinking of what they are saying. To please and be part of an organization and become slaves of fear and intimidation there after. Christians were saved to be free, not to be put back into bondage. Satan knows that Christ Jesus is the Savior so His name will naturally be subtly and for seeming good reasons never be allowed in lodge meetings. There is no more fearful name to Satan than the name of Christ Jesus who at the cross defeated Him, and in resurrection completed the plan. When Jesus said "It is finished" The forces of evil shook. The devil has perpetrated the same lie as he put forth in the garden. He said, "If you have this knowledge you can be like God." He is still using the same old tricks. You can save yourself through knowledge.

Freemasonry is an elaborate,evil seduction and deception. True Christians should run, not walk, from such an organization cutting all ties and repent of any oaths. Never to look back again. Jesus said if we deny Him before men, He would deny us before the Father. He also said that there would be many who would say at the end, Lord, Lord and He will say "I never knew you". That is a sobering and serious thing to consider. All things leading to Godliness are already in the Holy Bible. Masonic interpretations are un-needed and in opposition to true Christian growth. There is scripture in the book of Acts chapter 4 that speaks of the Stone that the builders rejected becoming the chief cornerstone. That Stone spoken of in the book of Acts is Jesus Christ. It is amazing to me that even then God provided scripture to speak to an organization based on stone masons. There is nothing new under the sun. Jesus is the Rock (or Stone) upon which a Christian's salvation is secure. He is the only way to God the Father. This GAOTU is a god all right but not Almighty God, Maker of heaven and earth. There is no name in scripture listed for the God of Abraham, Issac and Jacob, where He is referred to as GAOTU. It is a man-made name for a false deity. Again, a Christian who puts God's Word above any other Word, will not be able to continue as a Mason when reading what the Holy Bible actually teaches. The taking of oaths is forbidden as well, especially ones on pain of death. It may not seem serious to an unregenerate man, but to a true believer, it will strike Holy fear of a Holy God, who does not change, who the Bible says is the same yesterday, today and forever. God is not a man that He should lie.

So either you should consider if your idea of what a true Christian is, is actually compatible with scripture, or keep believing the lies. It is a very serious matter of eternal consequences.

JustTheTruth920
06-09-2011, 10:26 PM
Actually you need to say exactly where that is in the Bible. There are secrets and there are secrets. The ones Masons say they have are not secrets, they are simply the same old lies.
The secretiveness of the organization is a mark of a cult. However, there are enough men and women who have come out of it and shed light on much of what goes on that people can evaluate enough of it to know it is not of God. You don't have to know every part of the evil to see most of it. The Bible also speaks to that saying that the things that are hidden will be shouted from the rooftops. I can provide scripture references for everything I have written. And they will be in context. It is obvious you do not know your own Bible. If you studied the Word of God, the Holy Bible, a fraction of the time you spend studying these silly Masonic teachings you will see for yourself the truth of what I say. It is plain for anyone who is willing to see and follow the truth in the Word of God.
Cherry picking is exactly what Masons do with the Bible twisting it, adding to it and making it into a tool of deception. There will come a day when all of that will be judged, but there is a way out of that judgement and that is repentance and leaving lies behind. God is merciful to sinful men and women who come to Him in repentance. He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness. He is love but He is also Holy. Without Christ we have no hope of seeing a Holy God. But in Christ we are made new, and given eternal life. God is so good. But He is also just.

BlueAngel
06-09-2011, 10:28 PM
So either you should consider if your idea of what a true Christian is, is actually compatible with scripture, or keep believing the lies. It is a very serious matter of eternal consequences.

I am not a Christian, true or otherwise.

I do not belong to any religious group.

I believe in GOD and HE believes in ME!

That's all that is required.

KSigMason
06-09-2011, 10:30 PM
Who are these brave men and women from the OES? I mean, the men are by requirement Master Masons. The women are required to be related to a Master Mason, but are not entitled to anything in any other appendant order or anything from the Blue Lodge.

"Rainbow type groups"? Do you really know anything about the structure of the Masons? I mean, there is a group called Rainbow Girls, but they would know nothing of the mainstream bodies of Freemasonry. What do you consider to be the higher echelons of Freemasonry?

How is Freemasonry inspired by the devil? As for Bible references, the Good Book says that the wise man will keep a secret while the fool lets his mouth run.

Pride can be a good thing and a bad thing. Pride can make someone excel and do great things, but at other times it can inspire corrupt, horrible thoughts and actions. And I'm sure when you're talking about pride, you're talking about the Seven Deadly Sins, which actually are not found in the Bible. I'm skipping over a huge part of its history, but basically the 7 Deadly Sins didn't take hold until the 6th Century when enacted by Pope Gregory I.

I don't think he ever said that charity is exclusive to Freemasonry. No one has ever said that. Our charities do a lot of good work though as do most charities (Masonic or not).

I'm not going to say all Masons have, are, or will be good. Masons are still human and humans are flawed. Freemasonry has a penal system for punishing those who disgrace the Fraternity through their actions.

In the Lodge we use a generic term that to each Brother represents their individual creator as not all of our members are Christian. We don't use Christ's name specifically, but that is because we allow men of all faiths and in the Blue Lodge we don't elevate (nor do we say that everyone's God is the same or equal) any one religion over the other. Politics is also not allowed to be discussed within the Lodge as we want to keep harmony within the Lodge.

In the York Rite, we do pray specifically to Christ as the York Rite is for the most part a Christian-oriented branch of Freemasonry.

As for the "authentic Christianity" comments, but who are you to say what is in a man's heart and define their relationship with God. What authority do you hold for such a thing? No human has this authority to define my relationship with God.

Freemasonry is not a religion so it does exist for the salvation of your soul. It leaves that up to your individual faith.

The only darkness you hold is in regards to Freemasonry. Freemasonry never says you are in religious darkness.

Meaning a person who has believed by faith that Christ was the Only Begotten Son of God, born of a virgin, who lived a sinless life, was crucified in our place and rose on the third day for the dead, then ascended to heaven after 40 days. Who then sent His Holy Spirit to dwell in the hearts and be in union with the spirits of those who have asked Christ to come into their lives, forgive their sins and regenerate them, imput righteousness by grace as a free and unearned gift.
I have never denied Christ or denied any of the miracles he did and has done.

God knows what is in our hearts and it is by His judgement not yours that I will enter into His Heavenly Kingdom.

KSigMason
06-09-2011, 10:45 PM
Actually you need to say exactly where that is in the Bible.
I guess I'm not the one who needs to study his Bible more.

Proverbs 12:23 - A prudent man concealeth knowledge: but the heart of fools proclaimeth foolishness.

Proverbs 11:13 - A talebearer revealeth secrets: but he that is of a faithful spirit concealeth the matter.

Proverbs 10:14 - Wise men lay up knowledge: but the mouth of the foolish is near destruction. (please note that "lay up" means to store for future use)

The secretiveness of the organization is a mark of a cult.
You're confusing "secretiveness" with privacy, something everyone enjoys and has a right to. You even keep many things private, or secret, from others. That you cannot deny.

However, there are enough men and women who have come out of it and shed light on much of what goes on that people can evaluate enough of it to know it is not of God.
Such as who?

I am not a Christian, true or otherwise.

I do not belong to any religious group.

I believe in GOD and HE believes in ME!

That's all that is required.
I know you don't care what I'm about to say, but I can respect your belief. You're a strong willed individual who will no doubt live a worthy life.

BlueAngel
06-09-2011, 10:46 PM
In the York Rite, we do pray specifically to Christ as the York Rite is for the most part a Christian-oriented branch of Freemasonry.

Freemasonry is not a religion so it does exist for the salvation of your soul. It leaves that up to your individual faith.

Ah, dude, the York Rite is a branch of Freemasonry, so, therefore, if this branch of FREEMASONRY prays specifically to Christ this makes Freemasonry a religion.

You sound confused above and below.

You say that Freemasonry is not a religion so it DOES exist for the salavation of your soul, but leaves that up to your individual faith.

HUH?

Individual faith equals religion.

You say that FREEMASONRY exists for the salvation of your soul.

Salvation of soul equals religion.

Again, you sound confused.

KSigMason
06-09-2011, 10:55 PM
Sorry BA, been up for some time now and meant to put that it does NOT exist for the salvation of our soul. We do prayers, but we are not a religion. We believe that all things should begin and end with prayer. Many groups, not religions, do prayers either at the beginning and/or end of the meeting/event.

Again, if there are some typos, it is because I'm extremely tired and have slept really crappy lately.

BlueAngel
06-09-2011, 11:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueAngel http://www.clubconspiracy.com/forum/images/clubconspiracy/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.clubconspiracy.com/forum/f32/masons-evil-5791-34.html#post75340)
I am not a Christian, true or otherwise.

I do not belong to any religious group.

I believe in GOD and HE believes in ME!

That's all that is required.

KSigMason said:

I know you don't care what I'm about to say, but I can respect your belief. You're a strong willed individual who will no doubt live a worthy life.

================================================== ========

Please do not quote two members within the same post.

Yes, you're absolutely right.

I am a strong-willed individual who is living a worthy life and I plan on doiing so for a very, very, very, very, long time.

BlueAngel
06-09-2011, 11:03 PM
Sorry BA, been up for some time now and meant to put that it does NOT exist for the salvation of our soul. We do prayers, but we are not a religion. We believe that all things should begin and end with prayer. Many groups, not religions, do prayers either at the beginning and/or end of the meeting/event.

Again, if there are some typos, it is because I'm extremely tired and have slept really crappy lately.

Excuse me, but as you pointed out and as I have pointed out that which you have pointed out, Freemasonry is a religion.

Thanks for clarifying that for us.

KSigMason
06-09-2011, 11:04 PM
Please do not quote two members within the same post.

Yes, you're absolutely right.

I am a strong-willed individual who is living a worthy life and I plan on doiing so for a very, very, very, very, long time.
Sorry, I won't do it again. :D

I'm off to bed now. The Tylenol PM is kicking in. I'll be back on in a few days. Tomorrow is some fun filled traveling.

BlueAngel
06-09-2011, 11:17 PM
Sorry, I won't do it again. :D

I'm off to bed now. The Tylenol PM is kicking in. I'll be back on in a few days. Tomorrow is some fun filled traveling.

Thanks for the information about how the Tylenol PM you just swallowed is kicking in; how tired you are; that you'll be back in a few days and how your tomorrow is going to be filled with some fun traveling.

All of us here at CC are very interested in your personal life and are sitting on needles and pins awaiting your return in a few days.

So, thanks for sharing.

JustTheTruth920
06-10-2011, 12:16 PM
I am not referring to you then. My concern is for people who are Christians, authentic ones, being sucked in and deceived by the quasi-religious group called the Freemasons.

JustTheTruth920
06-10-2011, 12:28 PM
God does love you, but He is Holy and none of us are completely Holy. That is why He made a way for all of the world, whosoever will believe, to know and when we die to live with Him. I am not deluded enough to believe that a completely HOLY God will accept me by my own merits. I am sure if I put my good works up to yours, I'd come out as worthy (in the way you look at it) as you are, if not more so, but the Bible says that my goodness is like filthy rags compared to complete Holiness, complete perfection. So He in His great love made a way for us, through the sacrifice of the one Perfect Lamb of God, Jesus Christ.
I realize that many people who are church goers and call themselves Christians are merely religious, which to me is the opposite of what authentic Christianity is. Christianity is different from all other religions of the world as it is a "religion" of done, where all others are the religions of doing.
Grace is something that exists in no other religious theology. God knows you and He knows you are like the rest of us, which is less than absolute perfection, fallible, and you have committed at least one sin in your life. God, according to his word does not compare us to each other, but He sees the heart. His standard is perfection. We can't reach perfection, but we can receive Christ who is our Redeemer the one who paid the price for our missing the mark of perfection through his death, and resurrection.
If I depended on the Lord grading me against other people and letting me into His perfect heaven, then my being there would make it no longer a perfect place, without Christ. Now I am clothed in the righteousness of Christ, by faith and that is the reason, I have been made, by grace, worthy to enter in.

JustTheTruth920
06-10-2011, 12:37 PM
I put absolutely no faith in my good works to make me worthy for heaven. I put my faith in Jesus Christ who is the perfect man, the perfect sacrifice, and who in His amazing Love has put or as the Bible says "Imputed" his Righteousness on me. That is the only reason that I am now by grace worthy of heaven. Jesus is the reason and the only reason for my salvation. The good works come out of my changed and renewed spirit. I was in darkness and now the Light of the Spirit of Jesus Christ lives in me and walks in me, and confirms that He loves me and has saved me by His grace, for heaven. It is so simple most men who see themselves as having to earn or merit heaven are absolutely hostile towards grace (merited favor). Grace is too easy, they think, they must work and merit being called worthy so Mason or not, it is all the same futile self effort, making ourselves our own God. Freemasonry and un-regenerated mankind are in the same boat.

JustTheTruth920
06-10-2011, 12:47 PM
The Bible says different. That is not all that is required. All have sinned and come short of the glory of God. So yes, He does love you, but believe in your worthiness through your good works, no, that is not true of any of us. The Bible says our good works are as filthy rags. Works done outside of our union with Jesus Christ. The mark of any cult is where they put Jesus. If he was just a good man and not God incarnate, then he couldn't be good since he said of himself that He was God in the flesh. so that would make him a liar and not good at all.. As far as him never existing. The fact that he lived on earth has been proved over and over. And for me, the proof is that I know Him from inside. He is my Savior and friend. He said of Himself in John 3 that He came into the world not to condemn the world but that through Him the world might be saved.

KSigMason
06-10-2011, 06:36 PM
Excuse me, but as you pointed out and as I have pointed out that which you have pointed out, Freemasonry is a religion.

Thanks for clarifying that for us.
I have not said that Freemasonry is a religion. I have never said that. It doesn't meet the criteria for being a religion.

KSigMason
06-10-2011, 06:39 PM
I am not referring to you then. My concern is for people who are Christians, authentic ones, being sucked in and deceived by the quasi-religious group called the Freemasons.
I am an authentic one as I said. Again, who are you to define one's relationship with God? Can you see into my soul? Do you know God's judgement of me? I don't think so.

It's self righteous people like you that almost drove me entirely from going to church.

KSigMason
06-10-2011, 06:55 PM
First off, please note that from my previous post, that while I stopped going to church for a long time, my faith in Christ never stopped.

I am sure if I put my good works up to yours, I'd come out as worthy (in the way you look at it) as you are, if not more so, but the Bible says that my goodness is like filthy rags compared to complete Holiness, complete perfection.
Wow, just wow. Think a little highly of yourself don't ya? You know nothing about me and what I've done in my life. I'll never say you haven't lived a good life, as I don't know you, but you cannot say your life is comparable to someone else when you don't know them.

Again, I have never denied any of the tenets of Christianity. I know I'm not perfect and that Christ is my Redeemer.

I put absolutely no faith in my good works to make me worthy for heaven.
You should both have faith and do good deeds.

JustTheTruth920
06-10-2011, 11:25 PM
I am absolutely no one I am simply saying what the bible says is a Christian. I have no authority of myself but my authority as it is supposed be for all true Christians is the Bible. I only said that I would never presume that my good works however they might compare to yours would be the reason I am worthy of heaven. I have said, I have nothing in myself, but I have done by His grace the only thing that will make me worthy and that is accept that Jesus Christ paid for my worthiness. It is given, not achieved. Actually, I know I am nothing in and of my own self. My hope is totally in Christ Jesus alone. Yes, I have lived a very giving and morally straight life. Not that it is of any bearing on my worthiness for heaven. And I take no credit for whatever good is in me or that I have done. The only works worth anything are the ones that He in me does in and out through me. My faith is in Jesus Christ and my union with him is where the good works worth anything come from. The Bible says He is the vine we are merely branches. Except for the life of the vine, the branches would never have fruit. I actually think highly of Christ alone. Which is why saying that His very name can't be said in a lodge meeting, which does meet the criteria of what a religion is, is a big red flag, it is cult. Look up the definition. It is a false religion. A cult.

JustTheTruth920
06-10-2011, 11:28 PM
Your posts though do suggest that you have a very high opinion of yourself. I would never actually compare my deeds to anyone's. I said that to show that if we are using that as a judge of who is worthy, I say neither you or I according to the Bible no matter how "good" compared to others, we are is far, far from perfect which is the standard of a Holy God, who is perfect in every way. Thus the need for a Savior.

JustTheTruth920
06-10-2011, 11:39 PM
It is foolish, as St. Paul said to boast. Any good thing that has come from me has come from the Holy Spirit working in and out through me. This is true of every authentic Christian. We are the branches, He is the True Vine, the Bible says. It also says, "it is God who works in us to will and to do of His good pleasure." God the Holy Spirit. The Bible says if you have not the Son you don't have the Father. It is all in there. It is my authority. I have none in my own feeble reasoning.

JustTheTruth920
06-10-2011, 11:52 PM
Obviously, I said I do have faith and good deeds, though I take no credit for any of them. There is no such thing as true faith that doesn't produce good works. But it is all coming from His Spirit not my tries to do good. Attaining by good works is what Freemasonry teaches. It teaches "do all of our principles and you will be worthy of the Heavenly Lodge" or some such nonsense. If you are a Christian, then tell me how man made principles have even the least superior comparison to the pure word of God? It doesn't. You can be sure whatever comes out of the pride of humanity is evil and leads to arrogance and self-centeredness all the while pointing to some good deeds to justify themselves. Many, many people who have never stepped a foot into a Lodge are givers of the first degree of time, talent and money and not to gain some reward or title. More outside of the Lodge are givers than are members of the Lodge. Freely without having to tell everyone what they did.
This exclusiveness is simply pride. The idea of gaining some secret knowledge that regular people don't know is simply pride, it is all very foolish, especially for a born again Christian, because as a Christian, the Bible says the love of God has been shed abroad in our hearts. It also says we have the Light of Jesus living in us. It also says that the Holy Spirit is the teacher of any mysteries we need to know and this is available to every human being, regardless of sex, race, or handicap. It is a cult. That is the truth, it has, because most people don't know what is done behind closed doors, gained an appearance of goodness through the philanthropy that is widely broadcast. Enough of what goes on has been revealed for any knowledgeable (scripture - wise) Christian to discern. It is a great deception. But you have to be willing to really look at what scripture says to see that. Taking those oaths is forbidden in the Bible, and there are many other practices incompatible with authentic Christianity.

JustTheTruth920
06-11-2011, 12:10 AM
To say I am SELF-Righteous, is laughable. If anyone knows that in myself I have nothing and am not worthy of heaven, it is me, no matter how "good" a life I may have lead. Getting to heaven by keeping some principles and getting titles and degrees is what self-righteousness looks like. "Look at me, I am a good man, see all these other men in this exclusive organization tell me I am, I have all these degrees, I have given all this money, etc, etc." That is self-righteousness in a nutshell. I claim no true righteousness outside of what Christ has given me by simple Grace, through faith in His finished work. Maybe you better examine what self -righteousness really means. If freely given worthiness given by Christ to you, almost turned you away from church, then I feel sorry for you. Truly. That is all I have been talking about "His worthiness", given (imputed) to us, not my good deeds making me worthy but by His Grace. No one's good deeds will make them worthy for heaven or some silly celestial Lodge. Only Christ alone. His spirit produces good works, not our joining some cult.

KSigMason
06-11-2011, 08:10 AM
But you've made the assumption that I don't follow the Bible as you have previously said:

I am not referring to you then. My concern is for people who are Christians, authentic ones, being sucked in and deceived by the quasi-religious group called the Freemasons.
You have made assumption of which you would have no knowledge of.

I do believe all that I have done I have acheived, but by the good grace of God and how he has guided me in life. I am very thankful for my life as it is something I have almost lost several times; many before I even left my Mother's womb. I praise God for keeping me.

Which is why saying that His very name can't be said in a lodge meeting, which does meet the criteria of what a religion is is a big red flag, it is cult. Look up the definition. It is a false religion. A cult.
We allow men of all faith into our Lodge so we use a generic term so that every man may sit on an equal basis. The individual is important and so is his individual religion. To whom he prays is his own. When we pray I pray to Christ while I know one of my Brothers prays to Allah. It's what is in our heart that counts and God knows who is loyal. I know what a cult is and many things can be called a cult, to include the many, many churches out there. Any group that holds similar ideals can be called a cult, but by what you want the word to mean, Freemasonry is not.

I find it funny in the days where atheists are attacking God left and right, that some zealots find it necessary to attack a group who pushes for faith. You would think they would count us among them, but no, the self righteous hatred drives them to attack others, even those of the same faith. So much for "love one another".

I don't have a high opinion of myself, but I am assure of my knowledge of the Craft and its compatibility with Christianity.

Freemasonry even teaches that it is by the blessings of God that we will be welcome into Heaven.

So you think that "faith, hope, & charity" is wrong? You think "brotherly love, relief, & truth" is wrong? You think that the virtues "temperance, fortitude, prudence, & justice" is wrong?

I've never said that only Freemasons are charitable. Before I joined I was a long time donator to the Red Cross, homeless shelters, and the ACS. Freemasonry doesn't reward you with titles for just giving money. You must earn your place through the Lodge and all of Freemasonry. It teaches that your actions should be selfless and for good, not for sinister, ulterior, or mercenary motive. Freemasonry gives millions a day to charitable work, never asking for anything in return, as it should be.

This exclusiveness is simply pride.
By your words prior, isn't heaven "exclusive"?

I didn't join to gain some "secret knowledge". Nor do we say we're the only place to gain any enlightenment. I joined out of historical interest and as well I enjoy being a part of philanthropic organizations. Our meetings are not some meeting place of NWO planning. Our meetings are not that exciting.

Many of what has been "revealed" I have long proven as a lie.

I don't believe, nor should any Mason believe, that I will gain entry to Heaven by my acts in Freemasonry. Freemasonry doesn't teach that in any way. I didn't join Freemasonry to try and gain a free pass into Heaven. If you think that Freemasons believe we'll go to heaven for simply being members then you have a horrible misconceived knowledge of Freemasonry.

If freely given worthiness given by Christ to you, almost turned you away from church, then I feel sorry for you.
Like I said, I walked away from the church, not Christ. I don't need some preacher to tell me how to be good or how to define my relationship with Christ.

JustTheTruth920
06-11-2011, 02:38 PM
So you think that "faith, hope, & charity" is wrong? You think "brotherly love, relief, & truth" is wrong? You think that the virtues "temperance, fortitude, prudence, & justice" is wrong?

I've never said that only Freemasons are charitable. Before I joined I was a long time donator to the Red Cross, homeless shelters, and the ACS. Freemasonry doesn't reward you with titles for just giving money. You must earn your place through the Lodge and all of Freemasonry. It teaches that your actions should be selfless and for good, not for sinister, ulterior, or mercenary motive. Freemasonry gives millions a day to charitable work, never asking for anything in return, as it should be.

Those things come as a result of being a born again Christian and having the spirit of Christ living in you. No, not against those things, but when those things are the only thing not a secret, (because it makes an evil organization look good) in the case of Freemasonry, it is worthless as far as making good men better. Your faith is in a generic God, not the God of the Bible. There is no name like G.A.O.T. U. ascribed to Almighty God. The Bible says if you deny the Son before me, He would deny you before God.

Again what teachings for a Christian could be better the the Bible? Your principles are so far, far inferior to the the pure Word of God. No Christian needs secret knowledge and yes, that is what it is all about, having knowledge that you are told other people don't have. Pride of Life is what that is about and it is exactly what Satan promised in the garden of Eden.

Taking oaths to pagan Gods of the mystery religions is idolatry. But you know this if you know anything about the Bible which is the only book that was written for the edification of born again believers.

No, heaven is not exclusive. It is open to all who will simply receive the Savior, it is not closed to women or disabled men or from what I understand black men. In fact a friend of mine who was a practicing Mason 32 degree Scottish Rite has told me straight out that no black man would every be privy to the same knowledge that a white Mason receives.

JustTheTruth920
06-11-2011, 03:01 PM
You said, "Many of what has been "revealed" I have long proven as a lie."


So if you know that what you have been taught is a lie, then why stay with an organization which teaches lies??

JustTheTruth920
06-11-2011, 03:11 PM
I only make the assumption that you don't know the Bible by your inability to still see no contradiction between what Freemasonry teaches and what the Bible teaches.

There has been plenty revealed by ex-Masons. You can deny that it is true but then again, denial and lying or misrepresenting Freemasonry is simply part of the organization. You have made oaths that involved horrible bloody penalties for breaking them. First the Bible forbids making oaths, and the fact that you are making an oath with such bloody gruesome consequences is another example of the evil in the organization itself. There has been enough revealed by high ranking ex-Masons that any Christian who has studied and meditated on the Bible should discern what the true nature of the organization is. I know the pat answer is, "Oh they were only disgruntled ex-Masons, etc." Right. The testimonies I have read stated Biblically their reasons for leaving and repenting of their involvement. Most have compassion for those men still blinded to the truth. Not bitterness.

JustTheTruth920
06-11-2011, 03:24 PM
[quote=KSigMason;75363]
Freemasonry even teaches that it is by the blessings of God that we will be welcome into Heaven.

This is a half truth, it is by the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ than any person will be welcome to heaven. Jesus said of Himself, " I am THE WAY, THE TRUTH, THE LIFE, and no man comes to the Father but my me." The fact that Jesus offers salvation free to all is indeed a blessing, but it is not some generic blessings of God that make us welcome to heaven.

In the later degrees, one of the big "secret names" is Abaddon. This is a demon spoken of in Revelation. It is idolatry to make oaths to any other deity. The mystery religions are the old pagan religions. Allah is not the God of the Bible. The Koran demands killing all who do not follow its teachings. So either the Muslim "brother" is infiltrating for another purpose or he is in direct conflict with the teachings of his so called Holy book as well.

G.A.O.T.U. is also a made up name and is not the God of the Bible so every time you pray to that name you are committing idolatry as well.

Are Mason's evil, the individual Mason may not be evil but all are deceived and Christians are practicing the making of oaths, (which the Bible forbids) to who knows what pagan deity, saying of himself that He is in darkness, when the Bible says a true Christian is full of the True Light. So many, many things that are wrong for a Christian. It is a strong delusion.

JustTheTruth920
06-11-2011, 03:50 PM
Photocopied at Thomas Sargant - The Freemason's Manual (http://www.scribd.com/doc/26113264/Thomas-Sargant-)The-Freemason-s-Manual

This comes from page 10 of The Freemason's Manual:

The person who desires to be a Mason must be a man, believing in the existence of a Supreme Being, and of a future existence; at least twenty-one years of age; of good moral character, temperate, industrious, and capable of earning an honest livelihood;(got to pay those dues) he must come of his own free will and accord, uninfluenced by mercenary or other improper motives; be of sound mind and body; capable of reading and writing; not deformed or dismembered, but hale and sound in his physical conformation, having his right limbs as a man ought to have. (So a man who lost limbs serving honorably defending our country would not qualify)

Page 13 - second paragraph
The persons made masons or admitted members of a lodge must be good and true men, free born, and of mature and discreet age and sound judgement, no bondmen, no women, (so women could not qualify as good and true or moral?) no immoral or scandalous men, but of good report. (Shriners are known for their wild and immoral parties)

Married men and women take vows to each other and are charged that they are now one flesh. However, the secretiveness even from wives, breaks that charge of one flesh. So many, many things that are wrong about Freemasonry. while sounding very good on the surface.

JustTheTruth920
06-11-2011, 04:04 PM
Thomas Sargant - The Freemason's Manual (http://www.scribd.com/doc/26113264/Thomas-Sargant-The-Freemason-s-Manual)

Last of the first paragraph of Page 30 THE FREEMASON'S MANUAL

Hence the great, the primary object of the first degree, is to symbolize that birth of intellectual light into the mind; and the Entered Apprentice is the type of unregenerate man, (Christians are not unregenerate men) groping in moral and mental darkness, (the Bible says that born again men have been moved from darkness into the Kingdom of Light) and seeking for that light which is to guide his steps and point him to the path which leads to duty and to Him (G.A.O.T.U.???) who gives to duty its reward. Again, Almighty God has never taken the name of G.A.O.T.U. so it is just a man made name for a god who is not Almighty God, Yaweh, Jehovah. In fact, as a mason "progresses" he learns a name of G.A.O.T.U which is actually a mixture of the word Jehovah, Baal, and one other pagan deity.

Yes, it is works oriented religious organization, through the principles of Freemasonry. It is there in black and white. A Mason prays, worships and studies principles (in place of the Bible) these principles have no dependence on the Spirit of Jesus Christ, which is the exact opposite of what the Bible teaches. Freemason practices prayer, worship and studying material to make a person "better" is in essence what religion is, false religion but still a religion.

KSigMason
06-11-2011, 06:16 PM
I don't believe, nor should any Mason believe, that I will gain entry to Heaven by my acts in Freemasonry. Freemasonry doesn't teach that in any way. I didn't join Freemasonry to try and gain a free pass into Heaven. If you think that Freemasons believe we'll go to heaven for simply being members then you have a horrible misconceived knowledge of Freemasonry.

If freely given worthiness given by Christ to you, almost turned you away from church, then I feel sorry for you.
Like I said, I walked away from the church, not Christ. I don't need some preacher to tell me how to be good or how to define my relationship with Christ.

Freemasonry isn't about hording "secret knowledge". That's just a pathetic attack to say such a thing.

I didn't take oaths to pagan gods. I took my oaths to the one everliving God. Again, God knows what is in my heart. I took my oath on the Bible and swore it to God. He is who binds me to my oaths, not men in a club.

If your friend said that then he is not very Brotherly. I'm guessing he also ascribes to David Duke, but hey I'm not judging. I know many black men who are 33rd Masons. To deny anything to someone based on their race is despicable.

So if you know that what you have been taught is a lie, then why stay with an organization which teaches lies??
Quite the forked tongue. I didn't say what my organization teaches is a lie, but what anti-Masons say is a lie. Don't twist my words and take them out of context.

If there was actually in a truth to what "ex-Masons" say there would have been a larger exodus from the group.

There has been plenty revealed by ex-Masons. You can deny that it is true but then again, denial and lying or misrepresenting Freemasonry is simply part of the organization.
Really? From you pulling a quote here and there from me and then making a smart a** comment isn't misrepresenting? I've talked with many ex-Masons that are now vehement anti-Masons and much of what they say is a lie or a misconception. Most of them never attained anything in their time. I hold the titles some of them have held and have held positions higher than others have held. It's not pride here, but a fact. Some read into what just isn't there and left.

Actually the Bible doesn't say taking oaths is bad, but rather swearing them on certain things is bad. By this you're saying every public servent and officer is thereby breaking the word of God (those who as you said "serving honorable defending our country" take oaths). It is not so.

Numbers 30:2 - If a man vow a vow unto the LORD, or swear an oath to bind his soul with a bond; he shall not break his word, he shall do according to all that proceedeth out of his mouth.

In which degree does this occur? I'm guessing you think its in the 17th degree of the Scottish Rite. I have yet to go through the Scottish Rite, but as far as I can tell it is only an accusation by anti-Masons and can find no hard evidence. I await any you have. Even from what I've read from anti-Masons who claim this word is used, it doesn't say that it is used to swear an oath on, but rather to gain entry.

Do you even know where the word "pagan" comes from?

So a man who lost limbs serving honorably defending our country would not qualify)It's up to the Lodge who they admit. Not all jurisdictions have the same rules and requirements. I had just had knee surgery stemming from a tour I had just served and I was allowed in. Many of the ceremonies require interaction and if the candidate cannot fulfill that role then he cannot join.

There are several Masonic organizations that women can join. I guess the fact though that we're a FRATERNITY doesn't slip your mind does it? Some have written on this subject, but I'm sure no matter what answer I give you would not be satisfied.
off,
My girlfriend was more than okay with me going to Lodge. She even came as my date to Grand Lodge and there are many social events where the public is welcomed and the wives, and family, of Masons are not treated like second hand citizens.

My going to Masons doesn't break my vows and my spouse should have enough trust in me that she knows I would not do anything dishonest or wrong.

In fact, as a mason "progresses" he learns a name of G.A.O.T.U which is actually a mixture of the word Jehovah, Baal, and one other pagan deity.
Well, first off, no we don't learn that a name of God is a mixture of several different words. That is an accusation by Stephen Knight who makes a statement and says he has sources, but never cites them. He just states them as if we'll just take it as fact (and sadly, many have without researching it. As for Ba'al, yes, he is used to describe a Canaanite god, but the word ba'al is used dozens of times to describe locations, cities, and humans as well.

I'm so glad you brought up Baal. In May I read an interesting book called "Workman Unashamed" by Christopher Haffner who first starts talking about the very name of God and its start as YHWH leading to the transformation into Jehovah, meaning "Lord" and its applications through the Bible and variations between the different versions of the Bible. Examples is Jehovah Elohim, Jehovah Rohi, and so forth (fascinating read). He then starts on Ba'al and the Bible where he states the following things:

Despite the fact that no Royal Arch ritual uses the word Ba'al...

---

Throughout the Old Testament, the word Ba'al is an ordinary everyday word, with ordinary everyday meanings. It is true that it is used sixty-nine times to represent a Canaanite god or gods, although often not as a proper name, but as a description. It is used as a proper name of other things or persons many times. For Example Ba'al is the name of a city in 1 Chronicles 4:33. In 1 Chronicles 5:5 and 9:36, it is a name of a Jewish person.

It is used even more frequently in combination:

Baal Gad, Baal Hazor, Baal Hermon, Baal Meon, Baal Perazim, Baal Shalisha, Baal Tamar, Baal Zephon, Baalah, Baalath (feminine of Baal), Baalath Beor and Baale are names of towns or places.
Baal Hanan and Baalis are names of kings.
Baal Berith, Baal Peor, and Baal Zebub (Lord of the Flies) are names of gods.

---

However, what is much more significant is the use of baal translated into other words. It is translated as "master" four times...

---

This is very important, as by analogy, Yahweh is the Ba'al of Israel. Another translation is "owner" (twelve times).

---

A third translation is as husband (eleven times).

He then goes on to talk about Stephen Knight's book, The Brotherhood, and debunks much of the Masons worship Ba'al myth:

With disregard for logical thought, Knight makes assumptions about the meaning of the second Royal Arch word which appear nowhere in any Masonic ritual, and then treats them as if they were true. He proceeds to suggest that the words of an obscure sixteenth century demonologist are relevant to twentieth century Masons. Knight is attacking only what his imagination has led him to believe is the meaning of the second word, with no reference the only relevant meanings - those which are explained to every new Royal Arch Mason.

Quick question: What version of the Bible do you read?

BlueAngel
06-11-2011, 09:47 PM
KSigMason said:

"I didn't take oaths to pagan gods. I took my oaths to the one everliving God."

What oaths did you take to the one everliving GOD?

KSigMason
06-11-2011, 10:00 PM
KSigMason said:

"I didn't take oaths to pagan gods. I took my oaths to the one everliving God."

What oaths did you take to the one everliving GOD?
All 15 of them.

BlueAngel
06-11-2011, 10:26 PM
All 15 of them.

Kindly name the 15 oaths.

Thanks!

KSigMason
06-11-2011, 10:51 PM
Kindly name the 15 oaths.

Thanks!
Okay.

1. Enterred Apprentice 2. Fellowcraft 3. Master Mason 4. Mark Master 5. Past Master 6. Most Excellent Master (I know) 7. Royal Arch Mason 8. Royal Master 9. Select Master 10. Order of the Red Cross 11. Order of Malta 12. Order of the Temple 13. Order of the Knight of York 14. Order of the Eastern Star 15. Order of the High Priesthood (a body that has no priestly duties but rather commemorates the HPs of the Bible; High Priest is the name of the officer of the Royal Arch degree).

JustTheTruth920
06-12-2011, 03:49 PM
There is none so blind as those who will not see.

JustTheTruth920
06-12-2011, 04:13 PM
I bet the 15 oaths are somewhere on the Internet. As far as
The oaths and the gruesome penalties, you are reaching to compare them to oaths of office. Just as I figured you dismissed the testimonies of former high degreed masons
by a wholesale attack of their character. It is the pay reply
one will always hear. I am not against you personally
But am most certainly against an organization who does fit within the dictionary description of a religion. To forbid Christians from praying in the Name of their Lord and Savior. That one fact should be enough reason to run like he'll from it. All of the other reasons are just other reasons. You have not denied this is true. It is despicable about the race thing as well as the loss of limb thing. you deny that there are promises of exclusive knowledge. It is clear from even the manual posted on the Internet. But it is a spiritual blindness. And of course you will have Masons discrediting any detractors. Par for the course. As I said the are no so called principles that would come close to what every Christian has freely available by studying the Holy Bible. This is the simple truth. Your anger by calling me names tells me a lot. However you can no more convince me that what is actually true is false, any more than I can convince you that Freemasonry is a cult and though having the appearance of good, is deceptive at it's core. No amount of personal attacks will change the facts some of which you have admitted are true.
I don't think that I have attacked you personally only what you believe about freemasonry.

JustTheTruth920
06-12-2011, 04:14 PM
I bet the 15 oaths are somewhere on the Internet. As far as the oaths and the gruesome penalties, you are reaching to compare them to oaths of office.

Just as I figured you dismissed the testimonies of former high degree masons by a wholesale attack of their character. It is the pat reply one will always hear. I am not against you personally but am most certainly against an organization who does fit within the dictionary description of a religion and yet portray itself as something else.

I am praying that my friend who presently doesn't attend but still pays dues, will completely disconnect himself from Freemasonry. I realize like you it will take a miracle, but miracles happen everyday. I don't hate him and I don't hate you. What Freemasonry is, yes, it is anti- what the Bible teaches and for Christians yes, I hate that many have become involved in it, most innocently, since they don't tell you what it is really about until you are deep in it.

To forbid Christians from praying in the Name of their Lord and Savior. That one fact should be enough reason to run like hell from it. All of the other reasons are just other reasons. You have not denied this is true. It is despicable about the race thing as well as the loss of limb thing. you deny that there are promises of exclusive knowledge. It is clear from even the manual posted on the Internet. But it is a spiritual blindness. And of course you will have Masons discrediting any detractors. Par for the course. As I said the so called principles that wouldn't come close to what every Christian has freely available by studying the Holy Bible. This is the simple truth. Your anger by calling me names tells me a lot. However you can no more convince me that what is actually true is false, any more than I can convince you that Freemasonry is a cult and though having the appearance of good, is deceptive at it's core. No amount of personal attacks will change the facts some of which you have admitted are true.
I don't think that I have attacked you personally only what you believe about freemasonry.

Also, I am not sure what you meant by my friend not having the "authority" to say it. It is what he was told by another Mason. If it is not true everywhere, it apparently is in some lodges. yes, the prejudice is despicable but so is prejudice behind refusing to accept my example of a wounded soldier if it is such a great fraternity. Of course in my view someone rejected by the Freemasons is better off than they know. They have been spared the deception.

KSigMason
06-12-2011, 04:45 PM
I bet most of the oaths are on the net somewhere.

If you could, can you please post the "testimonies" of these "former high degreed Masons"? Can you post what degrees they've gone through and positions they've sat in? Degree doesn't rank. I mean I'm sure some were 32nd degree Scottish Rite Masons, but the Scottish Rite is not some superior degree above all others.

Freemasonry is not a religion:

Our purpose as freemasons is not that of a religion. Freemasonry lacks the basic elements of religion. Freemasonry is not a religion nor is it a substitute for religion.

-Freemasonry advocates no sectarian faith or practise.
-Freemasonry seeks no converts
-We solicit no new members
-We have no dogma or theology. Religious discussion is forbidden in a masonic lodge thereby eliminating the chance for any masonic dogma to form.
-It offers no sacraments and does not claim to lead to salvation by works, by secret knowledge, or by any other means. The secrets of Freemasonry are concerned with the modes of recognition only and not with the means of salvation.
-Freemasonry supports religion. Freemasonry is far from indifferent to religion. Without interfering in religious practise, it expects each member to follow his own faith.

A man does not subscribe to a new religion, much less to an anti-Christian religion when he becomes a freemason, any more than when he joins any political party or community association. There is nothing in Freemasonry that is opposed to the religion he brings with him into the masonic lodge. Freemasonry does not assert nor does it teach that one religion is as good as another. Freemasonry admits men of all religions. Freemasons believe in religious freedom and that the relationship between the individual and his God is personal, private and sacred.

SOURCE (http://freemasonry.bcy.ca/textfiles/religion.html)
Masonry is not a religion. He who makes of it a religious belief, falsifies and denaturalizes it.

To forbid Christians from praying in the Name of their Lord and Savior.
You misunderstand. In the Lodge (Blue Lodge) we use generic terms as we have men of all faiths. We cannot elevate our own faith above another in the Lodge, but when we pray its to the individual Creator that they pray to. When I pray I'm praying to Christ.

It is despicable about the race thing as well as the loss of limb thing.
I do deny what your "friend" said about black men. It is despicable and he has no authority to say that.

I am still curious as to what version of the Bible you read?

JustTheTruth920
06-12-2011, 10:57 PM
I am afraid you are quoting the typical Mason answer to it not being a religion. In any case, you can read testimonies which I am sure you will discount as disgruntled ex-Masons etc. etc. Try googling ex-masons for Jesus. They tell their stories, what degrees they attained and some talk about how many in their own families were also Masons etc. Which I am sure is very common. There are many testimonies. Why waste any more time putting a url when if you were really interested in the truth you'd investigate and read the other side by yourself by searching it out yourself. It is pointless to keep talking about it because you are only repeating what you have been instructed to say by your Masonic teachers or leaders or whatever the official titles are of those who instruct you in Masonic teachings. I am weary because this is not an open minded discussion where you are actually addressing these issues. You can't really answer the main one. Which is how can a Christian stay in ANY organization that will not allow the name of Jesus mentioned in the meetings. It is possible to be loving to mankind without being a Mason. Many people reach out to people from other cultures without giving up the freedom to say the name of Jesus their Savior. So I am over and out about this. I tried that is all I am responsible for when in a discussion with another professing Christian. I wish you well.

JustTheTruth920
06-12-2011, 11:08 PM
I read the Holy Bible, I prefer to read King James version Bible, but like some of the other translations as well. The difference between you and me at this point at least, is that I do actually study my Bible. If you studied yours a fraction of the time you spend memorizing Masonic rhetoric, you would see for yourself the incapability of Masonic teaching and the Bible. I mean when you read the Bible in context. Anyway, we could go on for months and this would get nowhere. A person has to want to know what the Bible teaches. You have to want to know that more than you want to be right. And at this point Freemasonry and whatever you are getting out of it, is simply more important to you. I wish you well.

KSigMason
06-12-2011, 11:26 PM
You realize that King James was a Freemason right?

I'll read through them again, and I'll post my reply. From a glance at each of the authors, I either am equal to the rank they held or have held a higher rank, or they weren't even Masons (rather they were apart of the the youth or women's organizations).

As for the whole family-Mason comment, I know of some families that have several Masons in them, but as for me, I'm the first in my family.

JustTheTruth920
06-12-2011, 11:41 PM
You said: A man does not subscribe to a new religion, much less to an anti-Christian religion when he becomes a freemason, any more than when he joins any political party or community association. There is nothing in Freemasonry that is opposed to the religion he brings with him into the masonic lodge. Freemasonry does nassert nor does it teach that one religion is as good as another. Freemasonry admits men of all religions. Freemasons believe in religious freedom and that the relationship between the individual and his God is personal, private and sacred.

If all of this is true then why is religious freedom suppressed in lodge meetings as well as freedom of speech?? That is a rhetorical question. I know you have a pat answer, but it joining a political group does not negate freedom of religious expression such as praying in the name of Jesus nor does it forbid the free expression of your religious views. There is just no way around it. The oaths taken by Masons is far and away different that taking an oath of office. They are taken in secret, not in the open for one thing. I have never heard of the Lion's Club or Civitan etc forbidding praying in the Name of Jesus either, in fact I have been to a meeting where I was a guest, in one of these meetings. It was in the open, no big secretive deal.
You know there is a big difference. But it is typical to make it appear to be the same. It is not. You know it, and I know it.

KSigMason
06-13-2011, 12:06 AM
If all of this is true then why is religious freedom suppressed in lodge meetings as well as freedom of speech??
I have explained this already to you.

The oaths taken by Masons is far and away different that taking an oath of office. They are taken in secret, not in the open for one thing.
Who is the one interpreting the Bible for their own sake now? The Bible doesn't say whether the oaths be in secret or not, nor do they make any differentiations between what kind of oaths are good and bad.

I have never heard of the Lion's Club or Civitan etc forbidding praying in the Name of Jesus either, in fact I have been to a meeting where I was a guest, in one of these meetings. It was in the open, no big secretive deal.
You know there is a big difference. But it is typical to make it appear to be the same. It is not. You know it, and I know it.
That's awesome for the Lion's Club. I've been to their meetings as well as Kiwanis. Here's the big thing though, as free citizens we are allowed to assemble as we wish.

JustTheTruth920
06-13-2011, 03:09 AM
Actually no, and you'd have to prove that. But he did not personally translate the Bible but rather he commissioned its translation. But of course you must have known that, right?

JustTheTruth920
06-13-2011, 03:11 AM
This is true, you are allowed to assemble that has not been the point of our discussion. The point is whether a Christian knowing that the name of Christ is prohibited from being mentioned should continue in such an organization seeing that Christ is the person who is our Savior, if He is not to be honored then who, for a Christian, should be?. The point is that Freemansonry is not like any other club as you mentioned. It differs in that way and in others. But you know this, don't you see that this is all double speak?

JustTheTruth920
06-13-2011, 03:20 AM
This is from a yahoo answer, so who knows who is telling the truth, however this answer seems much more likely than what you have said. Also if King James had been a Mason why would he be happy with a translation that would be in conflict with Masonic teachings

From Yahoo answers: to the question was King James a Mason?
Wow, I feel like I need to put on my chest waders for stepping into this swamp...
King James was not a Mason, the fraternity was not officially established until almost a century after his death. The actual working guilds of stonemasons, and certain intellectual circles that eventually came together to create the Masonic fraternity, did exist in James' lifetime, but it is highly unlikely a king would have been involved with commoners of this kind in his time.

There is no "Masonic M hand sign". If you care to research art history, you will find the explanation for paintings, statues, (and later posed photographs) exhibiting this configuration of the hands has to do with proportion and directing the eye to focal points of the work. The technique dates back far beyond Freemasonry existing.

Masonry does not have or perform oaths, charms, devilish or black arts nor astrology. Masonry has an obligation, which is different than an oath. Charms, astrology, etc. are superstitions that defy reason as well as the Word of God, and are offensive therefore to every Mason.

Masonry cannot be demonstrated to hate King James. He was dead before Masonry even existed. The Bible he commissioned, The King James Version, is the one Bible held by EVERY Masonic Lodge in the world, no matter where the Lodge resides or the religious make-up of its members.

The information I have provided you is accurate and factual. I don't care what your site says. If it says otherwise about Masonry or how it relates to James himself, it is wrong.
Source(s):
-Freemason

Although the guy is not telling the truth about the oaths etc. My point is here is another Mason saying the opposite. Where did you get that King James was a Mason.

Again he did not translate the Bible but commissioned learned men to do so.

JustTheTruth920
06-13-2011, 03:39 AM
King James I: Biography of King James I (http://www.jesus-is-lord.com/kingbio.htm)

The link above is his biography, he was a weak and sickly man, but a very learned man who was a devout Christian. There is no mention of being a Mason. Also why would a King associate with commoners as the Mason who answered the Yahoo question stated?
Also he was weak in body, isn't that a reason not to admit a man?
His life was devoted to study not Freemasonry. This is just another lie propogated by some in Freemasonry. King James is not alive to defend himself. So that is probably best not said.

In any case, he commissioned the translation and did not translate the Bible himself.

JustTheTruth920
06-13-2011, 03:46 AM
There was also a rumor that Billy Graham is a Freemason. This was been denied by the Billy Graham association, but Freemasons have the tendency to lie about who is or has been a Freemason. Why not? Lies are part and parcel of the "fraternity".

JustTheTruth920
06-13-2011, 03:53 AM
Did you know that rumors of King James being a Mason, or Billy Graham being a Mason or any other famous Christian being a Mason, even if true would not change a thing about my objections. Christ is above all for Christians. If you deny him before men, the Bible says he will deny you before the Father.
It seems very unlikely that King James would be part of a group that would not allow the mention of Christ's name in prayer. Or certainly that Billy Graham would be part of something like that, since his entire life is devoted to spreading the gospel. Something he would have been prohibited from doing as part of Freemasonry. It is ludicrous, the things that Masons will say to legitimize their organization.
You have already admitted that Jesus Christ can't be mentioned at meetings legally. People can say anything but that doesn't make it true. You'd have to have real proof about King James. Which you don't.

JustTheTruth920
06-13-2011, 04:35 AM
Once again it is really pointless to keep this up. I do agree, the Bible does not specify which kind of oath. I believe that a person who for religious reasons refuses to swear in in a court room is allowed to just say yes, I will tell the truth. But if you are comparing the bloody oaths of Freemasonry to oaths of office there is still a huge difference. I personally don't believe in taking oaths of any kind because of this scripture.

JustTheTruth920
06-13-2011, 04:37 AM
The first and foremost objection is the forbidding of using the name of Jesus inside of a lodge meeting. That one alone is enough to incriminate the lodge.
But there are many more reasons.

KSigMason
06-13-2011, 05:21 AM
Actually no, and you'd have to prove that. But he did not personally translate the Bible but rather he commissioned its translation. But of course you must have known that, right?
When King James was 35 he was initiated into Scoon and Perth Lodge #3 on April 15, 1601. He had a hand in a reorganization of Freemasonry in England. Also note that the KJV is the Bible used in most Masonic Lodges.

KSigMason
06-13-2011, 05:31 AM
This is true, you are allowed to assemble that has not been the point of our discussion. The point is whether a Christian knowing that the name of Christ is prohibited from being mentioned should continue in such an organization seeing that Christ is the person who is our Savior, if He is not to be honored then who, for a Christian, should be?. The point is that Freemansonry is not like any other club as you mentioned. It differs in that way and in others. But you know this, don't you see that this is all double speak?
When I say my prayers I say them to Christ. To those who worship him he is not denied. Freemasonry is a religious tolerant organization and as such we use generic terms to not hold one above another. In most Lodges the Bible sits on the altar as their membership is primarily Christian. In some places you can see either the Torah or the Koran sitting there, and in some places you see all 3. It's up to the Lodge really.

What is the point of Freemasonry to you then?

KSigMason
06-13-2011, 05:42 AM
As for the Freemason who responded on Yahoo answers, he must not have known.

Source (http://freemasonry.bcy.ca/biography/james_vi/james_vi.html): D. Crawford Smith and William James Hughan, History of the Ancient Masonic Lodge of Scoon and Perth (Number 3, The Lodge of Scone) Perth: Cowan and Company, Limited, 1898. Also see: Year Book of the Grand Lodge of Antient Free and Accepted Masons of Scotland 1990, p. 50. Note that the Contract or Mutual Agreement is the only record of this initiation, that this history was commissioned by the lodge to establish its claims of precedence, and there is no primary source documentation. Image: artist unknown 'detail'. Scottish National Portrait Gallery.
I also argue against the posters claim that ALL Masonic Lodges use the Bible because not all of them do. I know for a fact that there is a primarily Jewish Lodge in NY that doesn't use the Bible.

Also if King James had been a Mason why would he be happy with a translation that would be in conflict with Masonic teachings
I don't see a conflict and neither did he.

If the poster was a Mason he was mistaken and if knowing who he was I would correct him on his information so he knew better.

KSigMason
06-13-2011, 05:47 AM
Also he was weak in body, isn't that a reason not to admit a man?
Well, just because he was sickly doesn't mean he was incapable of going through the initiation and in that time it Freemasonry was going through a transformation and it was fairly aristocratic. Plus, do you really think that in that time they would deny admittance to a king? You're also under the presumption that they had the same membership requirements that we have now.

Also, your link isn't an official biography and is a type of site that doesn't seem to friendly to Freemasonry and thus I doubt would include that.

KSigMason
06-13-2011, 05:50 AM
There was also a rumor that Billy Graham is a Freemason. This was been denied by the Billy Graham association, but Freemasons have the tendency to lie about who is or has been a Freemason. Why not? Lies are part and parcel of the "fraternity".
Well who started the rumor? Do you have link to this rumor? Just because there's a rumor that he was a Freemason doesn't mean it was started by the Masons. There are tons of non-Masonic sites out there that claim all sorts of people are Freemasons who are in fact not, but they claim it nonetheless.

KSigMason
06-13-2011, 05:53 AM
Not mentioning in the Lodge isn't the same as denying him. In my prayers I pray to Christ and He knows this. He knows what is in my heart.

KSigMason
06-13-2011, 05:57 AM
The first and foremost objection is the forbidding of using the name of Jesus inside of a lodge meeting. That one alone is enough to incriminate the lodge.
But there are many more reasons.
Such as? So far all you've been ranting about is the lack of the use of Christ in the Blue Lodge. You've yet really to say anything else.

JustTheTruth920
06-13-2011, 07:55 AM
As I said I have friends who have gotten caught up in it who are Christians.

I don't believe there is evidence that King James was a Mason. Yes, he would have had to approve of something that if he compared the two things he would have known they are in contradiction to each other.

I understand that in your heart you were praying to Jesus Christ, but to have to not say his name in prayers that are said out loud is wrong.

If others would be offended by that why would they not also be offended by the Bible which would have the old and the New Testament (concerning Jewish members). Again, the G.A.O.T.U is not a legitimate name of God Almighty. It is the spoken name of Jesus apparently that is the big offense, not the Bible which has His name throughout the New Testament.

So you are saying that Muslim "worshippers" never say the name Allah? Or Buddists, "Budda"? If it is not a religion why have names like worshipful master, etc. It does fit all the criteria of a religion. I have seen my friend become suddenly angry over the least question about Freemasonry. If someone had questioned him about his faith in Christ, he would not respond with the same zeal. That is worrisome, that is more than just a fraternity. Those bloody oaths are not the same as an oath of office which is more a confirmation and certainly not said with blood gruesome consequences for not fulfilling that oath. There is something very dark and to me very evil about that kind of oath taking in particular. Also there is a direct quote and if I can find it, it says that Masons are striving to be accepted in the some kind of Celestial Lodge and it very definitely if considered as written and said is saying that the fulfillment of the principles of Masonry will make any man worthy of heaven. How else would Muslim, Hindu, and other religions see it? In any case, it makes no difference unless you or my friend are willing to really look at what is said and the real meaning behind it. Even in the scanned copy of the Freemason Manual you can see statements that indicate the same as I have been saying. But the Lord has to convict a person for one to see. There are many ways to do the same thing without being in a secret group, out in the open and in the Name of Jesus Christ. We are told to go and tell. This is not something you are allowed to do in Freemasonry. Anyway, this is something we will not agree upon. It is clear to me and I have seen the difference in my friend, for the worse since getting involved.

JustTheTruth920
06-13-2011, 07:59 AM
Ranting?? No, simply stating strongly what I see and believe about Freemasonry. That is the subject of this thread. Is Freemasonry evil? It is. I am not talking about individual men but the organization, yes, is evil. With a cloak of goodness about it.

There is a lot to say but the biggest thing that I see is the forced omission of the name of Jesus which to a Christian is a precious name above all other since it is that Name of that Savior who is our reason for expectation of heaven. By grace through faith.

Titus 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, by the washing of regeneration and the renewal of the Holy Spirit. (I don't see how it can be much clearer than that.) Those are not my words, my "ranting". Those are the words of the Bible. The Bible which is the only legitimate "manual" for any Christian.

For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. Hebrews 4:12

Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. 2 Timothy 2:15

All scripture [is] given by inspiration of God, and [is] profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 2: Timothy 3:16

I have not hid thy righteousness within my heart; I have declared thy faithfulness and thy salvation: I have not concealed thy lovingkindness and thy truth from the great congregation. Psalms 40:10

26 “So do not be afraid of them, for there is nothing concealed that will not be disclosed, or hidden that will not be made known. 27 What I tell you in the dark, speak in the daylight; what is whispered in your ear, proclaim from the roofs. 28 Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell. Matthew 10:26-28

20 O Timothy, guard the deposit entrusted to you. Avoid the irreverent babble and contradictions of what is falsely called “knowledge,” 21 for by professing it some have swerved from the faith. 1 Timothy 6:20-21

JustTheTruth920
06-13-2011, 08:35 AM
Neither was your link but was favorable to Freemasons.

JustTheTruth920
06-13-2011, 09:42 AM
"The universal, eternal, immutable religion, such as God planted it in the heart of universal humanity. No creed has ever been long lived that was not built upon this foundation...The ministers of this religion are all Masons... Its sacrifices to God are good works... and perpetual efforts to attain to all the moral perfection of which man is capable." (Page 219)
Morals and Dogma - Albert Pike

KSigMason
06-13-2011, 06:47 PM
As for Jewish members, they can request during their ceremonies that the Torah sit in place.

Who are you to say how I refer to God? In Masonic terms that is how he is referenced, at least in the Blue Lodge.

Worshipful Master is a title given to the presiding officer of the Lodge. Worshipful is derived from Old English meaning "one worthy of respect". We actually don't worship him. One of my maintenance guys is a conspiracy theorist and he's accused (not asked) the Masons of all sorts of crazy things. I don't get angry, I usually laugh, which in turns pisses him off. I have no problem asking questions, I encourage it. I stay civil as long as the other person stays civil. I'm a member of a political forum and its filled with religion hating atheists and I'm on their constantly defending the Faith and Christ. Sometimes it gets down right vicious.

Nowhere in our oaths do we talk about entry into the Celestial Lodge above. One of our symbols talks about the Celestial Lodge above, but it does not say by our works alone or by being Freemasons do we gain entry into our individual version of Heaven.

According to Jesus our works do matter (Matthew 25:31-46). The people rewarded and punished are done so by their actions.

James 2:17 - "Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone."

James 2:24 - "Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only."

James 2:26 - "For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also."

Matthew 7:20-21 - "Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven."

The Bible clearly shows that works are needed and that faith alone cannot gain you into Heaven. By the works you do they must be done for pure reasons, not selfish ones though. The Bible warns against this as well for you will not be rewarded.

As for your secrecy verses:

Proverbs 11:13 - "A talebearer revealeth secrets: but he that is of a faithful spirit concealeth the matter."

Proverbs 12:23 - "A prudent man concealeth knowledge: but the heart of fools proclaimeth foolishness."

Proverbs 25:9 - "Debate thy cause with thy neighbour himself; and discover not a secret to another:"

JustTheTruth920
06-13-2011, 07:11 PM
Works are a natural result of faith. But it has no part in salvation. It is the result of a person being saved and regenerated. Titus 3:5 again.

A true Christian will have works because of the Holy Spirit because as the Bible says " If any man be in Christ he is a new creature old things are passed away, all things are become new.'

Also the Bible says that it is God who works in us to will and to do of His good pleasure.

As I said, I in myself am no one other than a vessel of the Holy Spirit. The Bible says this of us who have accepted His free gift and asked Him into our hearts. I am simply saying what the Bible says. Anyway. I am not going to check my email anymore, I don't have time for pointless debates on this anymore.

I wish you well.

JustTheTruth920
06-13-2011, 07:19 PM
By the way, what I have said is clearly seen in the Freemasonry material. And the other is from scripture. A talebearer is someone who makes things up.

Anyway, I might ask the same question of you. Who are you to tell me what I should or shouldn't believe. If I believe the Bible who are you to accuse me of being anything when clearly you are simply ignoring most of what I have brought up.

Titus 3: 5 Not by works of righteous that we have done but according to His mercy He saved us by the washing of regeneration and the renewal of the Holy Spirit.

So no, works will never save us. But works are the natural result of being a changed person. You know nothing of my good works, which i don't take credit for anyway, anything worth mentioning is done by the Holy Spirit in and out through me. I have nothing in and of myself to boast of in good works, and yet, I have had many good works (which it is silly to even mention) because we are not accepted on our works.

But I have already said this, this is just a repeat. Anyway, we don't agree. So write something else but I am too busy to have to go over and over the same things. You and I don't agree and we will never agree on Freemasonry.
Again I wish you well.

It is over and out for me.

KSigMason
06-13-2011, 07:45 PM
So because Titus 3:5 says it, no other verse can possibly counter that? So James and Matthew were wrong? I clearly posted several verses that support good works being needed.

I'm not saying that without Freemasonry men cannot do good works, but I am saying that Freemasonry does do good deeds.

Who are you to tell me what I should or shouldn't believe. If I believe the Bible who are you to accuse me of being anything when clearly you are simply ignoring most of what I have brought up.
I never said you couldn't believe what you want, but I'm countering the points that are clearly wrong. You can believe it all day long, doesn't mean its true.

BlueAngel
06-13-2011, 09:38 PM
Okay.

1. Enterred Apprentice 2. Fellowcraft 3. Master Mason 4. Mark Master 5. Past Master 6. Most Excellent Master (I know) 7. Royal Arch Mason 8. Royal Master 9. Select Master 10. Order of the Red Cross 11. Order of Malta 12. Order of the Temple 13. Order of the Knight of York 14. Order of the Eastern Star 15. Order of the High Priesthood (a body that has no priestly duties but rather commemorates the HPs of the Bible; High Priest is the name of the officer of the Royal Arch degree).

Sorry, dude, but what you've posted aren't oaths.

You've merely named various branches and degress within the Freemasonry cult.

I suggest you try again.

KSigMason
06-13-2011, 09:51 PM
Each of those degrees has an obligation. I am not going to post everyone of the obligations though.

BlueAngel
06-13-2011, 09:55 PM
Each of those degrees has an obligation. I am not going to post everyone of the obligations though.

Why not?

KSigMason
06-13-2011, 10:06 PM
It's against my obligation to reveal them to non-members and even if you were I wouldn't post them on a open forum.

BlueAngel
06-13-2011, 10:40 PM
It's against my obligation to reveal them to non-members and even if you were I wouldn't post them on a open forum.

Since it's against your obligation to reveal anything about the FREEMASONRY SECRET SOCIETY of which you are a member, why are you here?

I think you should spend less time on CC and more time at the LODGE.

If you can't do that of your own free will, I can help you.

Thanks,
BA

KSigMason
06-13-2011, 11:05 PM
Well, I'm currently stuck at a passenger terminal trying to get back to my base so no Lodge for me.

BlueAngel
06-13-2011, 11:15 PM
Well, I'm currently stuck at a passenger terminal trying to get back to my base so no Lodge for me.

Oh, my, we are just so sorry that you're stuck at a passenger terminal trying to get back to your base.

Just about as sorry as we were the other night when you said you had to take a Tylenol PM to get to sleep.

Again, KSigMason, CC is not the least bit interested in your personal life or anything you propose to tell us about the secret Freemasonry society of which you are supposedly a member because you haven't told this forum anything about Freemasonry that we don't already know.

In fact, I think this forum has told you more about the Freemasonry society of which you are member and we aren't.

Everything you post on this forum is irrelevant.

Have a nice evening and I do hope you get back to your base and lodge real soon cause I have no clue how they can and/or will function without you.

But, rest assured, that once you've been banned from this forum we'll function fine without you!

P.S. Do you think that because you mention you're trying to get back to base, this somehow makes you a hero?

KSigMason
06-13-2011, 11:57 PM
Everything you post on this forum is irrelevant.
I'd rather have them be irrelevant than false like the many lies held against Freemasonry.

Have a nice evening and I do hope you get back to your base and lodge real soon cause I have no clue how they can and/or will function without you.

But, rest assured, that once you've been banned from this forum we'll function fine without you!
I won't be back to Lodge for months, but I see no reason to ban me again. I have broken no rules. Unless telling the truth is a violation of sorts on this forum, but then again this forum doesn't really thrive on truth.

BlueAngel
06-14-2011, 12:12 AM
I'd rather have them be irrelevant than false like the many lies held against Freemasonry.

Your posts are irrelevant because they are false.

Otherwise, name the 15 oaths.

If you can't and won't'; you've proven that your comments/posts on CC are irrelevant and false and that you shouldn't be posting on this forum and I'll see to that.

I won't be back to Lodge for months, but I see no reason to ban me again. I have broken no rules. Unless telling the truth is a violation of sorts on this forum, but then again this forum doesn't really thrive on truth.

You don't have to break any rules to be banned from Club Conspiracy. Please read the sticky at the top of this forum which states that anyone can be banned for any reason or no reason at all.

Capice?

Dude, this forum supports truth, but you don't as in refusing to name the 15 oahs.

KSigMason
06-14-2011, 12:59 AM
I did name the 15 oaths, I just didn't post the entirety of those obligations. The names of the oaths are the same as the degree they are found in, so therefore, I did name them. :p You can ban again if you will, but I'll still be back.

BlueAngel
06-14-2011, 01:05 AM
I did name the 15 oaths, I just didn't post the entirety of those obligations. The names of the oaths are the same as the degree they are found in, so therefore, I did name them. :p You can ban again if you will, but I'll still be back.

Dude, you didn't name the 15 oaths and if I ban you again I'll ban you forever; which I didn't do the last time; therefore, you won't be back.

:p

BlueAngel
06-14-2011, 01:12 AM
Inform the forum of Freemasonry's 15 oaths or be banned forever.

This forum is quite tired of your know all attitude, but can't part with the secret information.

FYI, CC is not a secret organization.

People here part with the information.

Part with it or be banned forever because, otherwise, your presence here on CC is useless.

KSigMason
06-14-2011, 01:29 AM
Dude, you didn't name the 15 oaths and if I ban you again I'll ban you forever; which I didn't do the last time; therefore, you won't be back.

:p
I did name them in this post (http://www.clubconspiracy.com/forum/f32/masons-evil-5791-37.html#post75376). I just didn't post the entirety because it is against my oath to do so and for you to ask me to is to break my fidelity, and I will never do such a thing.

I won't be back as KSigMason, but I'll be back under a different nom de guerre.

BlueAngel
06-15-2011, 03:53 PM
I did name them in this post (http://www.clubconspiracy.com/forum/f32/masons-evil-5791-37.html#post75376). I just didn't post the entirety because it is against my oath to do so and for you to ask me to is to break my fidelity, and I will never do such a thing.

I won't be back as KSigMason, but I'll be back under a different nom de guerre.

You haven't been banned so why would you come back under a different nom de guerre and, FYI, if you are banned as KSigMason and return under a different username, you'll be banned under that name, as well.

Since you can't post the 15 oaths because you took an oath not to reveal them, I suggest it is safe for us to assume that Freemasonry is a SECRET SOCIETY.

KSigMason
06-15-2011, 08:20 PM
You haven't been banned so why would you come back under a different nom de guerre and, FYI, if you are banned as KSigMason and return under a different username, you'll be banned under that name, as well.

Since you can't post the 15 oaths because you took an oath not to reveal them, I suggest it is safe for us to assume that Freemasonry is a SECRET SOCIETY.
I'd only show up under another name if you banned me and unless I made it clear who I was you wouldn't realize it was me.

No, secret societies hide their meeting location and who their members our. We don't. We're a private organization who has secrets.

BlueAngel
06-15-2011, 09:42 PM
I'd only show up under another name if you banned me and unless I made it clear who I was you wouldn't realize it was me.

No, secret societies hide their meeting location and who their members our. We don't. We're a private organization who has secrets.

Dude, if I ban you, you are banned.

And, if you re-appear under another user name, I'll be informed of the same and that username will be banned, as well.

If you can't disclose the 15 oaths of Freemasonry because you took an oath not to disclose same, than this verifies that Freemasonry is a secret society.

KSigMason
06-17-2011, 03:52 AM
If you say so.

BlueAngel
06-17-2011, 11:24 PM
I'd only show up under another name if you banned me and unless I made it clear who I was you wouldn't realize it was me.

No, secret societies hide their meeting location and who their members our. We don't. We're a private organization who has secrets.

Dude, do you seriously think that a member of this forum has to make it clear to the moderator that they are one and the same otherwise we are too stupid to know?

How many members of this forum do you think have come before you under different usernames that were banned by me because I knew they were one and the same?

We have our ways, KSigMason, so, if and when I ban you and you return under another username, rest assured, that whether you make it clear to me or not, I'll know that it is you and you'll be banned again.

Let me clarify for you since you seem to be confused.

Any society that hides their membership; their meeting locations and has secrets is a secret society.

FREEMASONRY is a secret society.

You are a member of a secret society; hence, the reason you cannot make public the 15 oaths; because they are secret to the secret society of Freemasonry of which you are a member.

KSigMason
06-17-2011, 11:52 PM
You have your ways? I'm guessing you think you'll be able to track my IP, but I can switch that pretty easily.

Freemasonry doesn't hide their membership or our meeting locations. Everyone has secrets. Secrets don't make something a secret society.

BlueAngel
06-19-2011, 05:48 PM
You have your ways? I'm guessing you think you'll be able to track my IP, but I can switch that pretty easily.

Freemasonry doesn't hide their membership or our meeting locations. Everyone has secrets. Secrets don't make something a secret society.

You can switch IP addresses and usernames all you want, but I'll still know it's you.

You're confused, Mason boy.

Firstly, you said, societies who hide their meeting locations and memberships are secret societies and Freemasonry doesn't do this so you consider Freemasonry is not a secret society.

Please tell the forum the names of the societies that hide their meeting locations and memberships so all of us can learn the names of these secret societies.

Oh, and BTW, this is your definition of a secret society; therefore it doesn't hold truth.

Further, you say that everyone has secrets and, although, they do that doesn't equate to them being a secret society.

HUH?

Which is it?

First, those societies who have secret meeting locations and memberships are secrets societies and now you say that everyone has secrets, but this doesn't make them a secret society.

I suggest you re-think what you wrote and get back to me.

Freemasonry hides their 15 oaths.

Hence, these oaths are secret to everyone other than those who are a member of their society.

Therefore, this equates to a secret society.

If you can't post them.

They are secrets.

Therefore, you belong to a secret society.

Deal with it, dude.

You can try double-speak, but it won't get past me.

I'll call you out every time.

Night, night!

trogers78
06-19-2011, 08:55 PM
I truly think they are evil

BlueAngel
06-19-2011, 09:52 PM
Well, I'll say the following.

KSigMason has proven that he is deceptive regarding his membership in the secret society of Freemasonry.

However, have a heart, because if they've deceived him than he is doing just as they have done to him.

Trying to deceive everyone else, but it doesn't fly on this forum.

Does that equate to evil?

Not in my opinion.

A liar, but not evil.

Until the time arrives that Mason boy posts the 15 oats of Freemasonry on this forum, there isn't any way he can confirm that Freemasonry is not a secret society.

KSigMason
06-21-2011, 06:01 AM
A liar, but not evil.
I have never lied.

BlueAngel
06-22-2011, 10:20 PM
I have never lied.

Yes you have, but we don't care about that.

We're more interested in you posting the 15 oaths of Freemasonry.

KSigMason
06-26-2011, 12:46 AM
Yes you have, but we don't care about that.

We're more interested in you posting the 15 oaths of Freemasonry.
I posted the degrees they belonged to, but I will not post the wording as that would make me a liar, and I am not a liar. I find it speaks much of someone's character when they want someone to break their word, their fidelity, in self interest.

BlueAngel
06-26-2011, 03:37 PM
I posted the degrees they belonged to, but I will not post the wording as that would make me a liar, and I am not a liar. I find it speaks much of someone's character when they want someone to break their word, their fidelity, in self interest.

Look, dude.

You say Freemasonry is not a secret society, but there are 15th oaths you cannot reveal to the public.

Posting the 15 oaths would make you a liar to no one other than the secret society to which you belong.

Your oath to keep secrets is between you and your Freemasonry brotherhood and not society at large.

Are we clear?

I feel it speaks to someone's character when they post on this forum about the secret society to which they belong; can't reveal the secrets and deny that they belong to a secret society all in their own self-interest.

Oh, yeah.

Boo, hoo.

I'm asking you to break your word.

Forgoodnesssakes, that truly speaks to the dispicable person that I am.

KSigMason
06-27-2011, 09:25 AM
We're a private organization with secret modes of recogntion. Much of ritual work can be found by anybody with half a brain.

I will not break my word for someone on the internet.

I'm asking you to break your word.

Forgoodnesssakes, that truly speaks to the dispicable person that I am.
I want to be a man of my word and that's despicable. I know in this day and age, keeping your word is something of an anomaly, but fidelity is far from despicable. You asking me to break my word is repugnant as is your character.

BlueAngel
06-27-2011, 10:22 PM
We're a private organization with secret modes of recogntion. Much of ritual work can be found by anybody with half a brain.

I will not break my word for someone on the internet.


I want to be a man of my word and that's despicable. I know in this day and age, keeping your word is something of an anomaly, but fidelity is far from despicable. You asking me to break my word is repugnant as is your character.

You're confused.

I never said you were a dispicable person.

I said I was a dispicable person.

Please learn how to recognize my tongue when it strikes at your cheek.

Yeah, right, you wouldn't break your vow of secrecy to someone on the internet but you would break it for someone else who isn't on the internet?

Okay, whatever!

Dude, calm down.

My goodness.

I asked you to break your code of silence and you refused and that makes my character repugnant.

Sorry, but you would be wrong.

My character is a sweet little ole' lady who is 55 years old and a charming one at that.

Don't get your panties all up in a bunch!

If you don't want to break your code of silence and continue to LIE about Freemasonry by stating that it's not a secret society, by all means, continue to do so, but it only makes you look like a silly man.

Keep on climbing that totem pole.

What do you mean when you say that much of ritual work can be found by anyone with half a brain?

KSigMason
06-28-2011, 06:52 AM
I'm sure you are a sweet person in real life. I will keep climbing and when I sit as Grand Master, I'll still come on here, and hopefully you're here to so we can exchange words then as well.

neopythagorean
09-16-2011, 09:47 AM
Masons are not sectarians. This is what has given us the reputation of being "evil" because fundamentalist religious people think that either you do it THEIR way or you are with the "devil".

We put aside our biases to meet on the level where everyone is equal and free. The garbage man and the CEO are the same. So are the Christian and the Moslem. If a man is a Mason, then that is good enough for us. Why? Because becoming a Mason means dedicating yourself to being wiser, more generous and to NEVER stop trying to help others--whether they are Masons or not.

Masons give with no need for recognition or reward. If there are secrets in Masonry, they are the many ways we help with no one knowing anything about it. We don't pass up a homeless guy without giving him relief. We don't pass a poor child without giving him a piece of candy or soda pop or something. We don't wait to see if others will help--we just up and do it. When a house burns down, we'll help the owners get on their feet. If a family is going hungry, we will sneak them food so that their pride isn't hurt. These are just a few "minor" examples. We want to help lift people up so that they can take care of themselves. We love people--ALL people, regardless of religion, economic status, politics, etc. If this is "evil", then I don't want to be "good".

stompk
09-26-2012, 07:37 AM
Bump

KSigMason
10-07-2012, 01:24 PM
Nope. Masons are still not evil.

stompk
10-07-2012, 02:04 PM
Nope. Masons are still not evil.

Still having sex with goats?

KSigMason
10-07-2012, 03:21 PM
Still having sex with goats?
I never had sex with a goat. I'm not into the bestiality scene.

stompk
10-07-2012, 03:59 PM
I never had sex with a goat. I'm not into the bestiality scene.

http://i35.tinypic.com/30c55yg.jpg
http://i34.tinypic.com/2r6e36h.jpg

KSigMason
10-09-2012, 12:05 AM
And this is evidence of my supposed bestiality?

Ozziecynic
10-09-2012, 10:56 PM
Ahoy stompk I hardly think attacking masons is a christian thing to do i mean Freemasonry= Religion any religion are like two peas in the same pod, we dont have this pyramid control system without it.
I dont really understand all these pple that attack freemasonry based on christian position when i have never encounted a christian in my physical or cyber experience that has ever had anything to say about masons at all, let alone be anti mason. Most lay christians so dumb they dont even think masons exist so how could they be anti or not.

KSigMason
10-09-2012, 11:40 PM
...i mean Freemasonry= Religion...
Freemasonry isn't a religion.

Ozziecynic
10-11-2012, 04:56 AM
Religion & freemasonry christianity something to me. Churches infested with your smelly brothers. Ministers have even hinted to me in their handshake, plus all their phony balony Political correctness, Humanism etc they seem to preach these things in sermons more than the Gospels themselves and this is protestants, baptists,methodists etc to be specific not just catholics which i regard as even worse. Infact only one thing worse than secret societies and thats religion any religion, in that respect i have something in common with agnostics.

stompk
10-11-2012, 06:41 AM
Ahoy stompk I hardly think attacking masons is a christian thing to do i mean Freemasonry= Religion any religion are like two peas in the same pod, we dont have this pyramid control system without it.
I dont really understand all these pple that attack freemasonry based on christian position when i have never encounted a christian in my physical or cyber experience that has ever had anything to say about masons at all, let alone be anti mason. Most lay christians so dumb they dont even think masons exist so how could they be anti or not.

Like I've said before, I'm not a Christian. I don't belong to any religion. I believe in God, and Jesus, but I feel the idea of a Church, Temple, or Lodge, is simply a device of control by Satan.

In America, every small town has the Masonic signs at the entrance of the town...they control all banking, politics, etc, and they are loyal to the Queen of England, which in my opinion is the most traitorous organization in America.

KSigMason
10-11-2012, 10:56 AM
Churches infested with your smelly brothers.
Smelly? That's harsh and unnecessary...and untrue. Plus are we not allowed to worship along side our fellow Christians (as many Masons are Christian)?

Ministers have even hinted to me in their handshake
Hinted what?

plus all their phony balony Political correctness, Humanism etc they seem to preach these things in sermons more than the Gospels themselves and this is protestants, baptists,methodists etc to be specific not just catholics which i regard as even worse.
What does political correctness or humanism have to do with Freemasonry?

If you don't like the sermon let the minister know.

Like I've said before, I'm not a Christian. I don't belong to any religion. I believe in God, and Jesus, but I feel the idea of a Church, Temple, or Lodge, is simply a device of control by Satan.
And you have the right to that opinion and belief. Nothing is wrong with having an opinion.

In America, every small town has the Masonic signs at the entrance of the town
Examples of this is? Can you really prove that EVERY small town has a Masonic sign at the entrance? I think you are exaggerating.

they control all banking, politics, etc,
Incorrect. Freemasonry has no control outside the bounds of the Lodge and an attempt to circumvent any process through Freemasonry is an offense that would earn a Brother expulsion.

and they are loyal to the Queen of England, which in my opinion is the most traitorous organization in America.
No we're not, on both of your assertions. We American Masons are not bound to the British Crown (Queen or King) nor do we foster any activity that would label us as traitorous by any rational mind.

stompk
05-21-2013, 07:48 AM
Ksig calls himself Emminent commander. Is this guy in love with himself, or what.

KSigMason
05-21-2013, 08:24 AM
Ksig calls himself Emminent commander. Is this guy in love with himself, or what.
I do love myself as everyone does, but my title is not something egotistical, it's a literal title.

The title "Eminent Commander" is my current office in the York Rite of Freemasonry, as I am in charge of a Commandery of Knights Templar (one of the bodies). I didn't choose the name as it was already set-up and has been set-up for nearly 2-centuries by the Grand Encampment.

KSigMason
05-22-2013, 01:26 AM
Ksig calls himself Emminent commander. Is this guy in love with himself, or what.
Plus, what does this have to do with the thread?

stompk
05-22-2013, 06:11 AM
I do love myself as everyone does, but my title is not something egotistical, it's a literal title.

The title "Eminent Commander" is my current office in the York Rite of Freemasonry, as I am in charge of a Commandery of Knights Templar (one of the bodies). I didn't choose the name as it was already set-up and has been set-up for nearly 2-centuries by the Grand Encampment.

What have you done to gain such a lofty title??

KSigMason
05-22-2013, 09:12 AM
What have you done to gain such a lofty title??
Short answer: I was elected.

Long answer: After attaining the Master Mason I waited 2-years before joining the York Rite as I worked on my proficiency ticket in Lodge. When I did join I didn't take an officer position in the Commandery as I was Master of my Lodge that year. It wasn't until after September when the Commander at the time was expelled and in the vacuum the officers moved up and I jumped into the line at the request of the acting-Commander. From there I moved up the lines of elected officers until I was finally elected last November to serve as Commander.

At the end of this year the members can vote me in again or elect someone else. I have no control over that. After this year is done I do not foresee myself presiding for the next several years.

KSigMason
10-27-2013, 12:13 PM
Religion & freemasonry christianity something to me. Churches infested with your smelly brothers. Ministers have even hinted to me in their handshake, plus all their phony balony Political correctness, Humanism etc they seem to preach these things in sermons more than the Gospels themselves and this is protestants, baptists,methodists etc to be specific not just catholics which i regard as even worse. Infact only one thing worse than secret societies and thats religion any religion, in that respect i have something in common with agnostics.
So Freemasons are not allowed to go to Church?

I don't get why everyone thinks that every awkward handshake is a Masonic grip. I'm completely against political correctness and no Freemasonry has nothing to do with humanism as you must have a belief in a Supreme Being before you're allowed to petition, and in some jurisdictions you must be Christian to join the Lodge. In the American York Rite you must be a Christian to join Knights Templar. I could keep going, but you should get the point.

I don't get why people see secrecy as wrong as it is universally used and there's nothing inherently wrong or immoral about it.