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Old 06-11-2011, 07:16 PM
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KSigMason KSigMason is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Idaho
Posts: 747
Default Re: Are the Masons evil?

I don't believe, nor should any Mason believe, that I will gain entry to Heaven by my acts in Freemasonry. Freemasonry doesn't teach that in any way. I didn't join Freemasonry to try and gain a free pass into Heaven. If you think that Freemasons believe we'll go to heaven for simply being members then you have a horrible misconceived knowledge of Freemasonry.

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If freely given worthiness given by Christ to you, almost turned you away from church, then I feel sorry for you.
Like I said, I walked away from the church, not Christ. I don't need some preacher to tell me how to be good or how to define my relationship with Christ.

Freemasonry isn't about hording "secret knowledge". That's just a pathetic attack to say such a thing.

I didn't take oaths to pagan gods. I took my oaths to the one everliving God. Again, God knows what is in my heart. I took my oath on the Bible and swore it to God. He is who binds me to my oaths, not men in a club.

If your friend said that then he is not very Brotherly. I'm guessing he also ascribes to David Duke, but hey I'm not judging. I know many black men who are 33rd Masons. To deny anything to someone based on their race is despicable.

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Originally Posted by JustTheTruth920 View Post
So if you know that what you have been taught is a lie, then why stay with an organization which teaches lies??
Quite the forked tongue. I didn't say what my organization teaches is a lie, but what anti-Masons say is a lie. Don't twist my words and take them out of context.

If there was actually in a truth to what "ex-Masons" say there would have been a larger exodus from the group.

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There has been plenty revealed by ex-Masons. You can deny that it is true but then again, denial and lying or misrepresenting Freemasonry is simply part of the organization.
Really? From you pulling a quote here and there from me and then making a smart a** comment isn't misrepresenting? I've talked with many ex-Masons that are now vehement anti-Masons and much of what they say is a lie or a misconception. Most of them never attained anything in their time. I hold the titles some of them have held and have held positions higher than others have held. It's not pride here, but a fact. Some read into what just isn't there and left.

Actually the Bible doesn't say taking oaths is bad, but rather swearing them on certain things is bad. By this you're saying every public servent and officer is thereby breaking the word of God (those who as you said "serving honorable defending our country" take oaths). It is not so.
Numbers 30:2 - If a man vow a vow unto the LORD, or swear an oath to bind his soul with a bond; he shall not break his word, he shall do according to all that proceedeth out of his mouth.
In which degree does this occur? I'm guessing you think its in the 17th degree of the Scottish Rite. I have yet to go through the Scottish Rite, but as far as I can tell it is only an accusation by anti-Masons and can find no hard evidence. I await any you have. Even from what I've read from anti-Masons who claim this word is used, it doesn't say that it is used to swear an oath on, but rather to gain entry.

Do you even know where the word "pagan" comes from?

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Originally Posted by JustTheTruth920 View Post
So a man who lost limbs serving honorably defending our country would not qualify)
It's up to the Lodge who they admit. Not all jurisdictions have the same rules and requirements. I had just had knee surgery stemming from a tour I had just served and I was allowed in. Many of the ceremonies require interaction and if the candidate cannot fulfill that role then he cannot join.

There are several Masonic organizations that women can join. I guess the fact though that we're a FRATERNITY doesn't slip your mind does it? Some have written on this subject, but I'm sure no matter what answer I give you would not be satisfied.
off,
My girlfriend was more than okay with me going to Lodge. She even came as my date to Grand Lodge and there are many social events where the public is welcomed and the wives, and family, of Masons are not treated like second hand citizens.

My going to Masons doesn't break my vows and my spouse should have enough trust in me that she knows I would not do anything dishonest or wrong.

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Originally Posted by JustTheTruth920 View Post
In fact, as a mason "progresses" he learns a name of G.A.O.T.U which is actually a mixture of the word Jehovah, Baal, and one other pagan deity.
Well, first off, no we don't learn that a name of God is a mixture of several different words. That is an accusation by Stephen Knight who makes a statement and says he has sources, but never cites them. He just states them as if we'll just take it as fact (and sadly, many have without researching it. As for Ba'al, yes, he is used to describe a Canaanite god, but the word ba'al is used dozens of times to describe locations, cities, and humans as well.

I'm so glad you brought up Baal. In May I read an interesting book called "Workman Unashamed" by Christopher Haffner who first starts talking about the very name of God and its start as YHWH leading to the transformation into Jehovah, meaning "Lord" and its applications through the Bible and variations between the different versions of the Bible. Examples is Jehovah Elohim, Jehovah Rohi, and so forth (fascinating read). He then starts on Ba'al and the Bible where he states the following things:

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Despite the fact that no Royal Arch ritual uses the word Ba'al...

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Throughout the Old Testament, the word Ba'al is an ordinary everyday word, with ordinary everyday meanings. It is true that it is used sixty-nine times to represent a Canaanite god or gods, although often not as a proper name, but as a description. It is used as a proper name of other things or persons many times. For Example Ba'al is the name of a city in 1 Chronicles 4:33. In 1 Chronicles 5:5 and 9:36, it is a name of a Jewish person.

It is used even more frequently in combination:

Baal Gad, Baal Hazor, Baal Hermon, Baal Meon, Baal Perazim, Baal Shalisha, Baal Tamar, Baal Zephon, Baalah, Baalath (feminine of Baal), Baalath Beor and Baale are names of towns or places.
Baal Hanan and Baalis are names of kings.
Baal Berith, Baal Peor, and Baal Zebub (Lord of the Flies) are names of gods.

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However, what is much more significant is the use of baal translated into other words. It is translated as "master" four times...

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This is very important, as by analogy, Yahweh is the Ba'al of Israel. Another translation is "owner" (twelve times).

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A third translation is as husband (eleven times).
He then goes on to talk about Stephen Knight's book, The Brotherhood, and debunks much of the Masons worship Ba'al myth:

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With disregard for logical thought, Knight makes assumptions about the meaning of the second Royal Arch word which appear nowhere in any Masonic ritual, and then treats them as if they were true. He proceeds to suggest that the words of an obscure sixteenth century demonologist are relevant to twentieth century Masons. Knight is attacking only what his imagination has led him to believe is the meaning of the second word, with no reference the only relevant meanings - those which are explained to every new Royal Arch Mason.
Quick question: What version of the Bible do you read?
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