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Old 04-16-2009, 07:44 PM
BlueAngel BlueAngel is offline
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Default IT'S CALLED TORTURE and NOT INTERROGATION TECHNIQUES!


Stop referring to TORTURE as INTERROGATION TECHNIQUES.

The police use Interrogation Techniques.

THE CIA uses TORTURE.

They are not one and the same.

I, for one, should know and I do.

CIA interrogation tactics: a terrifying ordeal

By MATT APUZZO, Associated Press Writer Matt Apuzzo, Associated Press Writer – 1 hr 19 mins ago
WASHINGTON – The journey into the CIA's most extreme interrogation program began in darkness.

Blindfolded, hooded and wearing earmuffs, suspected terrorists were shackled and flown to secret interrogation centers. The buildings themselves were quiet, clinical and designed to fill prisoners with dread. Detainees were shaved, stripped and photographed nude.

The questioning began mildly, a shackled detainee facing a non-threatening CIA interrogator. But for detainees who refused to cooperate, the interrogation escalated in terrifying ways.

Few people have ever witnessed the process, which was designed to extract secrets from "high value" suspects during the years after the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorism attacks on the U.S. But Justice Department documents, which the Obama administration simultaneously released and repudiated Thursday, describe the process from darkness to waterboarding in skin-crawling detail.

Prisoners were naked, shackled and hooded to start their interrogation sessions. When the CIA interrogator removed the hood, the questioning began. Whenever the prisoner resisted, the documents outlined a series of techniques the CIA could use to bring him back in line:

• Nudity, sleep deprivation and dietary restrictions kept prisoners compliant and reminded them they had no control over their basic needs. Clothes and food could be used as rewards for cooperation.

• Slapping prisoners on the face or abdomen was allowed. So was grabbing them forcefully by the collar or slamming them into a false wall, a technique called "walling" that had a goal of fear more than pain.

• Water hoses were used to douse the prisoners for minutes at a time. The hoses were turned on and off as the interrogation continued.

• Prisoners were put into one of three in "stress positions," such as sitting on the floor with legs out straight and arms raised in the air to cause discomfort.

At night, the detainees were shackled, standing naked or wearing a diaper. The length of sleep deprivation varied by prisoner but was authorized for up to 180 hours, or 7 1/2 days. Interrogation sessions ranged from 30 minutes to several hours and could be repeated as necessary and as approved by psychological and medical teams.

Some of these techniques, such as stripping a detainee naked, depriving him of sleep and putting a hood over his head, are prohibited under the U.S. Army Field Manual. But in 2002, the Justice Department authorized CIA interrogators to step up the pressure even further on suspected terrorist Abu Zubaydah.

Justice Department lawyers said the CIA could place Zubaydah in a cramped confinement box. Because Zubaydah appeared afraid of insects, they also authorized interrogators to place him in a box and fill it box with caterpillars (that tactic ultimately was not used).

Finally, the Justice Department authorized interrogators to take a step into what the United States now considers torture, waterboarding.

The Bush administration approved the use of waterboarding, a technique in which Zubaydah was strapped to a board, his feet raised above his head. His face was covered with a wet cloth as interrogators poured water over it.

The body responds as if it is drowning, over and over as the process is repeated.

"We find that the use of the waterboard constitutes a threat of imminent death," Justice Department attorneys wrote. "From the vantage point of any reasonable person undergoing this procedure in such circumstances, he would feel as if he is drowning at the very moment of the procedure due to the uncontrollable physiological sensation he is experiencing."

But attorneys decided that waterboarding caused "no pain or actual harm whatsoever" and so did not meet the "severe pain and suffering" standard to be considered torture.

President Barack Obama has ended the CIA's interrogation program. CIA interrogators are now required to follow Army guidelines, under which waterboarding and many of the techniques listed above are prohibited.

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Old 04-21-2009, 11:16 PM
BlueAngel BlueAngel is offline
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Default Re: IT'S CALLED TORTURE and NOT INTERROGATION TECHNIQUES!

Excuse me, but please do not mislead the American people into believing that the survival techniques taught to our soldiers to withstand interrogation if captured by the enemy are one and the same as being TORTURED.

Being tortured and learning survival techniques to withstand torture are NOT ONE AND THE SAME.

The sadistic pigs who torture don't use a SURVIVAL manual.

They use a TORTURE manual.

Furthermore, do not mislead the American people into believing that the only PEOPLE the CIA has ever tortured are those who were detained at GITMO and considered 911 suspects.

If I recall correctly, and I know that I do, the CIA's secret TORTURE prisons that are located on many islands throughout the world have been in existence for decades.

I was TORTURTED decades ago.

I AM not a TERRORIST; but, perhaps, considered to have been one by the corrupt powers that control our country.

Or, more importantly, used, as well, during my incarceration in MKULTRA/Project Monarch to test their torture techniques.

I'm certain that I am not the only American citizen who was tortured by Nazi scientists/doctors; Navy goons and other sadistic pigs who work for the CIA.

So, Obama, stands in front of CIA headquarters after the American public learns of their disgusting tactics at GITMO and praises them in order to boost their morale.

The CIA could care less about having their morale boosted.

They have no morals.

It's a show to try to make the CIA appear not to be the "rogue" and corrupt organization that it is in the eyes of the American people.

The CIA doesn't work for the President.

The President works for the CIA.

They operate with or without his approval.

Report Details Pentagon Role in Torture Tactics

Report Details Pentagon Role in Torture Tactics

Obama open to torture prosecutions

Obama: No torture charges for CIA

Obama: CIA Is 'More Important Than Ever'

ABC News

By BOBBY GHOSH/WASHINGTON, D.C. Bobby Ghosh/washington, D.c. – 56 mins ago

Opponents of last week's release of memos detailing CIA interrogation techniques argue that they will provide enemies of the United States with a training manual to prepare their operatives for capture. The irony is that the U.S. military appears to have done the exact opposite, taking a training program that had been designed to prepare American soldiers to withstand torture by communist regimes seeking to extract false confessions, and twisting it into a highly controversial interrogation manual.

The story of that mutation emerges in disquieting detail in a new report by the Senate Armed Services Committee (SASC) on the treatment of detainees in U.S. custody. It shows how U.S. interrogators at Abu Ghraib, Guantanamo Bay and camps in Afghanistan based some of their interrogations on techniques taken from the military's Survival, Evasion, Resistance and Escape (SERE) training program. These techniques included water-boarding, walling (slamming detainees into a flexible wall), sleep deprivation, hooding and using dogs to inspire fear. (See pictures of life inside Guantanamo)

Although an executive summary of the report had been released last December; the full version - which appears to have survived the Pentagon's declassification review with only mild redaction - will likely have much greater impact, coming on the heels of the CIA "torture memos" released last week.

In a statement, SASC chairman Sen. Carl Levin said the report "represents a condemnation of both the Bush Administration's interrogation policies and of senior Administration officials who attempted to shift the blame for abuse - such as that seen at Abu Ghraib, Guantanamo Bay, and Afghanistan - to low ranking soldiers."

While much of the controversy over interrogation and detention practices at Guantanamo has centered on the CIA, the SASC report puts the spotlight firmly on the Pentagon - specifically on former Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, his DoD lawyer Jim Haynes, his policy chief Douglas Feith, Guantanamo commanders Maj. Gen. Michael Dunleavy and Maj Gen Geoffrey Miller, and a raft of other DoD officials. It offers a detailed account purporting to show how these officials - some of them knowingly, others unwittingly - allowed SERE techniques to be used for interrogation. It suggests, too, that many SERE experts and military lawyers raised concerns about and objections to this reverse-engineering of techniques used in courses to train Americans to survive captures by communist regimes.

The process began in December 2001, when the DoD's office of general counsel asked the Joint Personnel Recovery Agency (JPRA), which oversees the SERE program, about detainee "exploitation." Within a few months, SERE trainers were training military interrogators bound for Gitmo. (The JPRA would also pass on its expertise to the CIA.)

Soon afterward, the first alarms began to sound. Jerald Ogrisseg, an Air Force SERE psychologist, warned the JPRA chief of staff Daniel Baumgartner that waterboarding detainees was illegal. In Oct 2002, Lt. Col Morgan Banks, an Army SERE psychologist, warned officials at Gitmo of the risks of using SERE techniques for interrogation, pointing out that even with the Army's careful monitoring, injuries and accidents did happen. "The risk with real detainees is increased exponentially," he wrote.

But by then, the Department of Justice's Office of Legal Counsel (OLC) had already issued two legal opinions, signed by Assistant Attorney General Jay Bybee, declaring that the techniques did not amount to torture. JPRA training for Gitmo interrogators was stepped up. In December, with Rumsfeld's authorization, officials of the Joint Task Force at Gitmo devised a standard operating procedure for the use of many SERE techniques to interrogate detainees.

Rumsfeld would rescind his authorization in a manner of weeks, after the Navy General Counsel, Alberto Mora, raised concerns about many techniques, arguing that they violated U.S. and international laws and constituted, at worst, torture. Mora met Haynes and warned him that the "interrogation policies could threaten [Rumsfeld's] tenure and could even damage the Presidnecy."

But even after Rumsfeld in January 2003 rescinded the authority for the use of SERE techniques at Gitmo, they remained in use in Afghanistan, and later in Iraq. Since Rumsfeld never declared these techniques illegal, military lawyers down the line were able to cite his original authorization as Pentagon policy. JPRA instructors would eventually travel to Iraq to train military interrogators there.

In the summer of 2004, JPRA was even considering sending trainers to Afghanistan, prompting another SERE psychologist, Col. Kenneth Rollins, to warn his colleagues by e-mail: "[W]e need to really stress the difference between what instructors do at SERE school (done to INCREASE RESISTANCE capability in students) versus what is taught at interrogator school (done to gather information). What is done by SERE instructors is by definition ineffective interrogator conduct. Simply stated, SERE school does not train you on how to interrogate, and things you 'learn' there by osmosis about interrogation are probably wrong if copied by interrogators."

The final irony: The torture techniques around which the SERE training was devised were used by Chinese interrogators during the Korean War, not to gather actionable intelligence but to force false confessions from captured U.S. soldiers - confessions that could then be used in anti-American propaganda.

Last edited by BlueAngel : 04-22-2009 at 12:09 AM.
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Old 04-21-2009, 11:34 PM
BlueAngel BlueAngel is offline
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Default Re: IT'S CALLED TORTURE and NOT INTERROGATION TECHNIQUES!

Excerpt:

"But attorneys decided that waterboarding caused "no pain or actual harm whatsoever" and so did not meet the "severe pain and suffering" standard to be considered torture."

I am so thrilled that ATTORNEYS have made this decision.

Thank goodness for lawyers.

They know all.

Hey.

Here's an idea.

How 'bout these attorneys undergo some waterboarding by the CIA and then get back to us regarding whether or not they stand by their decision.

The Justice department considers waterboarding to constitute a threat of imminent danger.

Obviously, one feels as though they are drowning.

There isn't any need for discussion on the subject of waterboarding.

Waterboarding meets the TORTURE criteria, because irregardless of the fact that these bone-headed attorneys find it doesn't cause any physical harm or suffering, they ARE NOT considering the psychological suffering and harm.

And, that is the POINT.

Waterboarding is torture.

Period!

Last edited by BlueAngel : 04-21-2009 at 11:58 PM.
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Old 04-22-2009, 09:03 AM
Darth Cacodaemon Darth Cacodaemon is offline
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Default Re: IT'S CALLED TORTURE and NOT INTERROGATION TECHNIQUES!

Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueAngel View Post
Excerpt:

"But attorneys decided that waterboarding caused "no pain or actual harm whatsoever" and so did not meet the "severe pain and suffering" standard to be considered torture."

I am so thrilled that ATTORNEYS have made this decision.

Thank goodness for lawyers.

They know all.

Hey.

Here's an idea.

How 'bout these attorneys undergo some waterboarding by the CIA and then get back to us regarding whether or not they stand by their decision.

The Justice department considers waterboarding to constitute a threat of imminent danger.

Obviously, one feels as though they are drowning.

There isn't any need for discussion on the subject of waterboarding.

Waterboarding meets the TORTURE criteria, because irregardless of the fact that these bone-headed attorneys find it doesn't cause any physical harm or suffering, they ARE NOT considering the psychological suffering and harm.

And, that is the POINT.

Waterboarding is torture.

Period!

Forgot you're Thorazine this morning, BlueAngel?
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Old 04-22-2009, 10:03 AM
BlueAngel BlueAngel is offline
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Default Re: IT'S CALLED TORTURE and NOT INTERROGATION TECHNIQUES!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Cacodaemon View Post
Forgot you're Thorazine this morning, BlueAngel?
Why would what I posted indicate to you that I am taking Thorazine and forgot to ingest it this morning?

I DO NOT take THORAZINE, but I'm certain, the same as you appear to be that I was forced to take THORAZINE and other drugs while being tortured by the sadistic pigs.

Their hope was that they would have succeeded in BREAKING me and upon returning to my home, I would have to remain on this drug for the rest of my life.

Once again, they failed in their endeavor to control me.

ALL IS WELL with me!
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Old 04-22-2009, 02:39 PM
Darth Cacodaemon Darth Cacodaemon is offline
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Question Re: IT'S CALLED TORTURE and NOT INTERROGATION TECHNIQUES!

Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueAngel View Post
Why would what I posted indicate to you that I am taking Thorazine and forgot to ingest it this morning?

I DO NOT take THORAZINE, but I'm certain, the same as you appear to be that I was forced to take THORAZINE and other drugs while being tortured by the sadistic pigs.

Their hope was that they would have succeeded in BREAKING me and upon returning to my home, I would have to remain on this drug for the rest of my life.

Once again, they failed in their endeavor to control me.

ALL IS WELL with me!
I sense your anger towards the "Pigs"..Perhaps they were sent to lead YOU to ME. Pain is a teacher and payback is a bitch.
Are you going to moan about this forever? If so, then you're wasting your breath. Or..Do you intend to do something about it?

There is nothing more pathetic then someone who bitches and moans, but won't do anything about it. So which will you be, a perpetual victim or will you do what is necessary, even if it is difficult, to get your pound of flesh?
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Old 04-22-2009, 05:19 PM
BlueAngel BlueAngel is offline
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Default Re: IT'S CALLED TORTURE and NOT INTERROGATION TECHNIQUES!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Cacodaemon View Post
I sense your anger towards the "Pigs"..Perhaps they were sent to lead YOU to ME. Pain is a teacher and payback is a bitch.
Are you going to moan about this forever? If so, then you're wasting your breath. Or..Do you intend to do something about it?

There is nothing more pathetic then someone who bitches and moans, but won't do anything about it. So which will you be, a perpetual victim or will you do what is necessary, even if it is difficult, to get your pound of flesh?
Excuse me, but I'm not bitching and moaning.

I'm contributing to the forum about this topic.

I WAS a victim.

Operative word:

"WAS"

I am a SURVIVOR.

The mind controllers who tortured and abused me were not sent to me and, even if they were, I'm CERTAIN beyond a reasonable doubt it wasn't so that I would be led to you.

An anonymous poster on an internet forum.

Please tell the forum to what you are referring when you ask if I am going to do what is necessary, even if it is difficult, to get my pound of flesh.

No need to be obscure.

Or, is there?

I mean, if you weren't obscure, you would have to be clear and concise as to what you are inferring and that isn't how people like you operate.

I know what you're suggesting, but you don't want anyone else reading this forum to know, now do you?

Good thing I don't reside in a suggestible state of mind, isn't it?

Last edited by BlueAngel : 04-22-2009 at 08:55 PM.
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Old 04-23-2009, 10:03 PM
BlueAngel BlueAngel is offline
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Default Re: IT'S CALLED TORTURE and NOT INTERROGATION TECHNIQUES!

Bump!
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  #9  
Old 04-30-2009, 08:24 PM
BlueAngel BlueAngel is offline
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Default Re: IT'S CALLED TORTURE and NOT INTERROGATION TECHNIQUES!

Former 'enemy combatant' pleads guilty in Illinois

A former "enemy combatant" who was held without charges has pleaded guilty, in order to face a lesser sentence, for conspiring with Al-Qaeda.

Al-Marri, a legal U.S. resident, was arrested in late 2001 while studying at Bradley in Peoria after federal authorities alleged he was tied to organizers of the 2001 attacks.

The Bush administration declared al-Marri an "enemy combatant" in 2003 and held him without charges for more than five years at a Navy brig in South Carolina. His attorneys say he was tortured there.

--------------------------------------------------------------------

Oh, great.

This man was held for five years at a Navy brig in South Carolina and tortured.

Tortured for five years!

Wonderful.

It took five years of torture to get a confession?

I guess you'll say whatever they want you to say when you're held without charges, tortured for five years and told you'll face 30 years in prison if you don't plead guilty.

Just let me go.

I can hear myself NOW!

I'll say whatever you want me to say.

Is this suppose to make us believe that TORTURE works because this man admitted to aiding and abetting a terrorist organization after he was tortured for five years and held without charges?

Former 'enemy combatant' pleads guilty in Illinois

By DAVID MERCER, Associated Press Writer
David Mercer, Associated Press Writer – 52 mins ago

PEORIA, Ill. – A man who was locked up without charges for years pleaded guilty Thursday to training in al-Qaida camps and coming to the United States on a mission for the terrorist group the day before the Sept. 11 attacks.

Ali al-Marri, 43, admitted to one count of conspiring to provide material support or resources to a foreign terrorist organization. A second charge of providing material support or resources to a foreign terrorist organization was dropped.

Al-Marri faces up to 15 years in prison and a $250,000 fine at his July 30 sentencing, though he will be credited for 18 months spent in civilian custody. His attorneys say they'll argue that he should get credit for the time spent in military custody, too — more than five years.

"Without a doubt, this case is a grim reminder of the seriousness of the threat we, as a nation, still face," U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder said in a statement Thursday. "But it also reflects what we can achieve when we have faith in our criminal justice system and are unwavering in our commitment to the values upon which this nation was founded and the rule of law."

Al-Marri's attorneys said their client, a married father of five from Qatar, chose to plead guilty to avoid the risk, if found guilty, of spending 30 years in prison.

"We thought (the plea) was the right approach to take based on the evidence the government allowed us to review over the last several weeks," attorney Andy Savage said outside the federal courthouse in Peoria.

When the judge asked al-Marri how would plead, the diminutive Bradley University graduate, seated at a table with his lawyers, paused briefly before answering without emotion, "guilty."

Al-Marri admitted he trained in al-Qaida camps and stayed in al-Qaida safe houses in Pakistan between 1998 and 2001, where he learned how to handle weapons and how to communicate by phone and e-mail using a code.

He also admitted meeting and having regular contact with Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, the alleged mastermind of the Sept. 11 attacks, and with Mustafa Ahmad al-Hawsawi, who allegedly helped the Sept. 11 hijackers with money and Western-style clothing.

Al-Marri, a legal U.S. resident, was arrested in late 2001 while studying at Bradley in Peoria after federal authorities alleged he was tied to organizers of the 2001 attacks.

The Bush administration declared al-Marri an "enemy combatant" in 2003 and held him without charges for more than five years at a Navy brig in South Carolina. His attorneys say he was tortured there.

The "enemy combatant" designation was dropped when he was indicted by a federal grand jury in Illinois. He was moved to a federal prison in Pekin, Ill., just outside Peoria, in March, and remains there.

Holder said President Barack Obama ordered him to review the al-Marri case shortly after Obama took office in January.

Al-Marri got a bachelor's degree in business management administration from Bradley in 1991, then went to work for a bank in Qatar. The government said he met with Osama bin Laden in the summer of 2001 and was sent to the U.S. to help al-Qaida operatives carry out post-Sept. 11, 2001, attacks.

Al-Marri obtained a student visa and returned to the U.S. the day before terrorists crashed two hijacked passenger planes into the World Trade Center and the Pentagon.

(This version CORRECTS that al-Marri was declared an enemy combatant in 2003.)

Last edited by BlueAngel : 04-30-2009 at 08:28 PM.
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  #10  
Old 04-30-2009, 08:54 PM
BlueAngel BlueAngel is offline
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Default Re: IT'S CALLED TORTURE and NOT INTERROGATION TECHNIQUES!

Why do they refer to this man as a former "Al Qaeda" SLEEPER AGENT?

• Former al-Qaida sleeper agent pleads guilty in Illinois court

How would they know this man is a SLEEPER AGENT unless they put him to sleep?

Putting one to sleep infers "mind control" programming is present and we all know about the CIA's connection to mind control and their use of AGENTS to do their dirty work for them so their hands remain clean.

Case in point:

Lee Harvey Oswald.

So, this man admits to aiding and abetting Al Qaeda after five years of being tortured and, wallah, TORTURE works.

The CIA is trying to look good.

Sorry, but as someone who underwent torture in order to silence me, I can state with certainty that most times when the CIA tortures, they do so in an attempt silence people as to their involvement in their lives.

Last edited by BlueAngel : 04-30-2009 at 09:21 PM.
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