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  #31  
Old 02-08-2005, 03:46 AM
Ahmad Ahmad is offline
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Default Re: Aliens are in fact Demons


Peace Saturnino,

If you accept your parent's religion without questioning it, you would be hurting your soul.

you said:
"as a Christian, I have to say that we believe Jesus was fully human and fully God. Trinity means that God is one, but is expressed in three persons: Son (Jesus), Father and Holy Ghost, so no idolatry here."


1- how could Jesus be a creature and a creator in the same time?

2- If God is one, and Jesus is a different entity, how could Jesus be a God?

3- If God is one but expressed in three persons, why did Jesus relate all his knowledge to that God, and stressed on this fact time and time again in the bible. And how could a part of god implore another part of the same god?

No insult intended, just trying to confront the vague areas.

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  #32  
Old 02-08-2005, 04:10 AM
Vlad Vlad is offline
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Default Re: Aliens are in fact Demons

Peace, Ahmad.

It is dogma to us: something that you take and believe like is being told: One in Three, Three in One, the Christ’s double nature (divine and human at the same time). Our limited minds cannot understand “how come”. We take it for granted and believe me, it's not that hard to believe!

For a kind of a “terrestrial” explanation, I give you the following quotation from G.K. Chesterton’s great book “Orthodoxy”:

“If we take any other doctrine that has been called old-fashioned we shall find the case the same. It is the same, for instance, in the deep matter of the Trinity. Unitarians (a sect never to be mentioned without a special respect for their distinguished intellectual dignity and high intellectual honour) are often reformers by the accident that throws so many small sects into such an attitude. But there is nothing in the least liberal or akin to reform in the substitution of pure monotheism for the Trinity. The complex God of the Athanasian Creed may be an enigma for the intellect; but He is far less likely to gather the mystery and cruelty of a Sultan than the lonely god of Omar or Mahomet. The god who is a mere awful unity is not only a king but an Eastern king. The HEART of humanity, especially of European humanity, is certainly much more satisfied by the strange hints and symbols that gather round the Trinitarian idea, the image of a council at which mercy pleads as well as justice, the conception of a sort of liberty and variety existing even in the inmost chamber of the world. For Western religion has always felt keenly the idea "it is not well for man to be alone." The social instinct asserted itself everywhere as when the Eastern idea of hermits was practically expelled by the Western idea of monks. So even asceticism became brotherly; and the Trappists were sociable even when they were silent. If this love of a living complexity be our test, it is certainly healthier to have the Trinitarian religion than the Unitarian. For to us Trinitarians (if I may say it with reverence)—to us God Himself is a society. It is indeed a fathomless mystery of theology, and even if I were theologian enough to deal with it directly, it would not be relevant to do so here. Suffice it to say here that this triple enigma is as comforting as wine and open as an English fireside; that this thing that bewilders the intellect utterly quiets the heart: but out of the desert, from the dry places and the dreadful suns, come the cruel children of the lonely God; the real Unitarians who with scimitar in hand have laid waste the world. For it is not well for God to be alone.”
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  #33  
Old 02-08-2005, 05:34 AM
Ahmad Ahmad is offline
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Default Re: Aliens are in fact Demons

Peace Vlad,

I have some remarks on the article you quoted, which i find more mysterious than the idea of "trinity" itself.

1- "For Western religion has always felt keenly the idea "it is not well for man to be alone." "

Indeed man cannot survive alone because he is imperfect, meaning he is totally dependent on his creator. But this can't apply to the Creator Himself, because He is self sufficient.

1- "The complex God of the Athanasian Creed may be an enigma for the intellect; but He is far less likely to gather the mystery and cruelty of a Sultan than the lonely god of Omar or Mahomet."


Well, that's a very broad claim without giving any intellectual proof to back it!. why would the lonely god of Mahmot be cruel?

2- "the image of a council at which mercy pleads as well as justice"

Why would God who is the only perfect self sufficient being be in need for consultation? and with whom? the idea of a council entails different entities with different opinions who after due consultation reach a unanimous decision. This very idea needs a group of gods, not one god!. so the author clearly means more than one god negotiating with each other before judging. Now if that's true and there are more than one god, which one of them did create us, the human beings? and if everyone of them created some of us, how would you explain the unity and perfect harmony of the creation?. Wouldn't they eventually separate, each with his own creation? why this never happened?

[17:42] Say, "If there were any other gods beside Him, as they claim, they would have tried to overthrow the Possessor of the throne."

[17:43] Be He glorified, He is much too exalted, far above their utterances.

[17:44] Glorifying Him are the seven universes, the earth, and everyone in them. There is nothing that does not glorify Him, but you do not understand their glorification. He is Clement, Forgiver.

3- "If this love of a living complexity be our test, it is certainly healthier to have the Trinitarian religion than the Unitarian."

Why would anyone love a complex, inunderstandable idea? and what kind of security would be gained from such vagueness?. The author keeps praising the mystery and benefits of trinitarian religion, yet never backs it with any intellectual argument! why?. Do youthink God would create us without the means to decipher the truth? if our minds are not capable of reaching the truth, why did God create them anyway?. "Mystery" and the love of it is the easy way out from confronting our dillemmas.

4- "even if I were theologian enough to deal with it directly, it would not be relevant to do so here."

At least he is truthful for once, he admits that he CAN NOT explain the very idea he praises! why then does he expect anybody to believe it?

5- "Suffice it to say here that this triple enigma is as comforting as wine and open as an English fireside; that this thing that bewilders the intellect utterly quiets the heart: but out of the desert, from the dry places and the dreadful suns, come the cruel children of the lonely God; the real Unitarians who with scimitar in hand have laid waste the world. For it is not well for God to be alone.”

I can't imagine such a vague argument to be sufficient for anyone, except those who AVOID the truth. As for the truthseekers, they can't extinguish the burning thirst in their hearts with such an ambiguity. Indeed, wine is the perfect distraction for those who avoid the truth, what a relief, it is the same as escaping to the fantasy world of video games, porno and the movies. A real human being would CONFRONT his worst mysteries, before they confront him when it's too late.
How wonderful to relate the trinitarian dogma with a vague realm of no right and wrong, and the unitarian one with a sword which blade separates the truth from falsehood, it is indeed true. And it is also true that the author has revealed his real conviction at the end, that man is god.


"it is not well for man to be alone."
"For it is not well for God to be alone."

-------------------------------------------
[7:172] Recall that your Lord summoned all the descendants of Adam, and had them bear witness for themselves: "Am I not your Lord?" They all said, "Yes. We bear witness." Thus, you cannot say on the Day of Resurrection, "We were not aware of this."

[7:173] Nor can you say, "It was our parents who practiced idolatry, and we simply followed in their footsteps. Will You punish us because of what others have innovated?"

[7:174] We thus explain the revelations, to enable the people to redeem themselves.

------------------------------------

[4:171] O people of the scripture, do not transgress the limits of your religion, and do not say about GOD except the truth. The Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, was a messenger of GOD, and His word that He had sent to Mary, and a revelation from Him. Therefore, you shall believe in GOD and His messengers. You shall not say, "Trinity." You shall refrain from this for your own good. GOD is only one god. Be He glorified; He is much too glorious to have a son. To Him belongs everything in the heavens and everything on earth. GOD suffices as Lord and Master.
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  #34  
Old 02-08-2005, 06:18 AM
Vlad Vlad is offline
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Default Re: Aliens are in fact Demons

Peace. If One would have been self-suficient, he would have never created anything. But One's main characteristic is Love. This is why One needed the other Persons and persons.

More tomorrow, please excuse me, I have to get home!
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  #35  
Old 02-08-2005, 07:05 AM
Ahmad Ahmad is offline
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Default Re: Aliens are in fact Demons

[35:15] O people, you are the ones who need GOD, while GOD is in no need of anyone, the Most Praiseworthy.
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  #36  
Old 02-08-2005, 07:17 AM
shadowman shadowman is offline
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Default Re: Aliens are in fact Demons

Quote:
Ahmad wrote:
[35:15] O people, you are the ones who need GOD, while GOD is in no need of anyone, the Most Praiseworthy.
I guess your god likes to play games. Doesn't need us? Then what the f--- get to be worshipped and prayed to?
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  #37  
Old 02-13-2005, 08:25 AM
Draken Draken is offline
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Default Re: Aliens are in fact Demons

"I was a hidden treasure wanting to be known, so I manifested creation so as to be known."
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  #38  
Old 02-22-2005, 04:27 PM
Saturnino Saturnino is offline
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Default Re: Aliens are in fact Demons

Hi Ahmad,

Jesus was God from the beginning. In fact, the Bible says all things were made and are sustained by Him. Nobody could explain how God is one but manifested in three persons, but this is what is clear from the Bible. There are mysteries that only God understands, and this is one of them. This notion is so far above our understanding that we have to accept by faith what Jesus taught about it.
When Jesus came to earth, he was not created, for that would be impossible. He just came to live with us in a human body, living a perfect life without sin and becoming the perfect sacrifice to pay for the sins of men. Before that, He was in perfect union with the Father and the Spirit, and maintained communion while on earth thru prayer and obedience to the will of the Father. In Him, however, all the fullness of God was manifested. He never ceased to be God. The 3 persons of Trinity are totally in harmony in purpose, action and glory, so when you know Jesus, you get to know God in totality.
The Holy Spirit is also one of the persons of God and was sent as the consolator to inhabit the hearts of those who believe.

Since Muslims believe in Genesis, you can check:

1) Gen 1:1 - the Hebrew word for God is Elohim. This is a plural noun, but the verb is singular. This teaches that there is one God in a plurality.

2) Gen 1:26 - again God is spoken in plural, Elohim, but we know that God is one from other passages like De 6:4.

3) Gen 11: 7,8 - again God is spoken in plural and singular at the same time.


As someone said, if you try to understand the Trinity, you lose your mind, if you don`t believe in it, you lose your soul.
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  #39  
Old 02-22-2005, 10:08 PM
AISB_Watch AISB_Watch is offline
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Default Re: Aliens are in fact Demons

Signs From Heaven, by Bishop Seraphim Rose

UFOs & the Cult of ET: The Phantasmagorical Manipulation, by Terry Melanson

Spotlight on UFOs: Are Aliens Demons?, by Jeffrey Scott

UFOs, the Antichrist & the New World Order, by Gord Tong

UFO-Alien Abduction Phenomenon, by Tim Unruh

UFO's: The Shattering Assault, by Father Alexey Young

The Secret Commonwealth of Elves Fauns & Fairies, by Terry Melanson

Demons in Alien's Clothing, by Ron Patton

A Brief Account Of The True Nature Of The 'UFO Entities', by Gordon Creighton

Ritual Magic, Mind Control and the UFO Phenomenon, by Adam Gorightly
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  #40  
Old 02-23-2005, 06:09 AM
get_real get_real is offline
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Default Re: Aliens are in fact Demons

Hello AISB:
Have read some of these a while back. Very interesting. However, I would like to ask you about Betty and Barney Hill, and whether or not these are 'sealed' records. It seems that this case has great significance. I'm not saying other cases don't hold any water, but... with this case there seemed to be a definite "hush hush", unlike any other case. They gave us some info via the press, but...
Have there been any updates of info, from surviving family members, or friends of Betty and Barney sharing some info they had received, other than what we think we know from the media.
I couldn't find anything of lately on the internet, didn't know if any book(s) (of recent) on UFO's highlights Betty and Barney.
Can you share?
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