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  #21  
Old 12-09-2004, 02:39 PM
55132 55132 is offline
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Default Re: Dis-information.


Ahmad

Because I read your post I posted mine. And I feel this more than answers your post.

I have no reason to think that you are not a sincere believer in a reformed Islam. But sadly what you propose goes totaly againts what is written in your holy book ) and in the traditions and history of your system, and you cannot change that.

Unless you are proposing a new muslim testament with a new profet there is no future in what you expose.

In islam the more you depart from your writting the more humane it becomes unfortuantly the reverse is true also.

I will not answer a verse by verse debate because it will lead nowhere. We can be here shooting texts against texts for the next 20 years. I go to directly to the root.

Peace be with you Ahmad I wish no ill but I will always stand against what you and your brethern say. Because God is GOD of Love.



55132

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  #22  
Old 12-10-2004, 04:17 AM
Ahmad Ahmad is offline
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Default Re: Dis-information.

55312 said: "But sadly what you propose goes totaly againts what is written in your holy book )"


Based on your postings (or cut and pastes) i don't think you ever bothered to reasearch the subject thoroughly before you embrace this attitude against Quran. I presented you the Truth but you don't want the truth, you want some disinfo. cut and pasted from here and there to make an opinion of yours!


I know just one thing about all of this, Satan tries to discredit "Submission" the original religion of Abraham, his plan is nearly completed with the war on terror. First he divided Submission into three disbuting factions (Judaism, Christianity and Islam) and then he is now in the final stages of his plan driving these three factions against each other for no other reason but to destroy his enemy, the human being, and to drive the people away from God and anything to do with religion.

However God also has a plan, and it will swallow all this vicious scheme of Satan very soon God willing.

You seem to have totally ignored my points, that i am not calling to the present day Islam, but on the contrary trying to give you the ONE TRUTH that Satan and his NWO satanist leaders don't want you to know, that GOD IS ONE who has no equal, raising a human being (even if he is a prophet) to a divine rank is what the NWO wants of you, the most obvious example is the Celebrity-worship satanic cult.

Before you post another hate thread, please be carefull with your sources, and try to be objective, logical and don't follow your opinion and put it above the truth.

What you presented is truth (about the corruption of modern day Islam represented by the satanic Hadith books) but mixed with falsehood (trying to discredit Quran, God's final testament). So if you can't debate properly, please refrain from these kinds of posts.
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[3:19] The only religion approved by GOD is \"Submission.\"...
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  #23  
Old 12-10-2004, 06:54 AM
marypopinz marypopinz is offline
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Default Re: Dis-information.

Mr. Moslem dude, I truly appreciate the strength of your faith.

If you choose to believe I am going to hell because I believe Jesus Christ was the spirit of God, incarnate, so be it.

If you to choose to believe all souls sans Islam are going to hell, you are in for a pretty rude awakening when you get there. I don't believe heaven is solely for the Christians or the Moslems, it's the home of all God's children.

Heaven is for those who have faith and believe in the power of love, forgiveness and understanding.

If I get their first, I'll make sure to hold the door open for you. Would you do the same for me my Moslem brother, or would you have God slam the gates in my Christian face?

As a parent, I find this my God is better than your God attitude very immature, no disrespect intended. :-? All religions have been corrupted by men, wake up; that's why God wrote the message on your heart... compassion is the word.

Peace Mary X
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  #24  
Old 12-10-2004, 09:18 AM
Ahmad Ahmad is offline
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Default The Truth shall set you free, if you only let it!

Peace,

First there is no argument between me and you, i believe you recieved the message of "Submission" it all depends on your decision.

You asked me a question,

marypopinz said: "If I get their first, I'll make sure to hold the door open for you. Would you do the same for me my Moslem brother, or would you have God slam the gates in my Christian face?"


God answers that question in Quran (the final testament), since He is the Only One who judges on the day of judgment, there is no intercession on that day,

1-The only unforgivable sin is "Idolatry" (e.g: worshipping creatures, things&people like the prophets and saints, e.g:Jesus,Muhammad):

[4:48] GOD does not forgive idolatry, but He forgives lesser offenses for whomever He wills. Anyone who sets up idols beside GOD, has forged a horrendous offense.


2-God calls those who set up partners beside Him and idolize Jesus and mortal creatures Pagans:

[5:17]Pagans indeed are those who say that GOD is the Messiah, the son of Mary. Say, "Who could oppose GOD if He willed to annihilate the Messiah, son of Mary, and his mother, and everyone on earth?" To GOD belongs the sovereignty of the heavens and the earth, and everything between them. He creates whatever He wills. GOD is Omnipotent.

[5:72]Pagans indeed are those who say that GOD is the Messiah, son of Mary. The Messiah himself said, "O Children of Israel, you shall worship GOD; my Lord and your Lord." Anyone who sets up any idol beside GOD, GOD has forbidden Paradise for him, and his destiny is Hell. The wicked have no helpers.

[5:73] Pagans indeed are those who say that GOD is a third of a trinity. There is no god except the one god. Unless they refrain from saying this, those who disbelieve among them will incur a painful retribution.



The Truth has been delivered to you, now the choice is yours, GOD ALONE or GOD + a creature ?

no hatred, no insult intended, just peace.
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  #25  
Old 12-10-2004, 10:34 AM
marypopinz marypopinz is offline
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Default Re: The Truth shall set you free, if you only let it!

I understand what you are saying and please understand my perception of Jesus Christ.

A. I can't be bothered to find the exact quote and Jesus told everyone that he was not God, don't call him God, because their is only one God. The father in heaven.

B. i.)Jesus was born of flesh and I was not there. Realistically, I do not believe in immaculate conception and having an open mind and an open heart to God, believing that God can do ANYTHING - in my mind, yes it is possible. It could have happened that way. God can do anything.
ii.) The constant re-writing of the Bible, changing things here and there makes me question its authenticity as opposed to the Quran which is written in its original tongue, I believe, correct me if I'm wrong.

C. Could God send his spirit into a human child?Yes, most definiteley. God can do anything.

D. Would this child be God? One came from the other. No. Of God, yes.

E. What if God came through this child and visited earth for a time, in human form? Is that possible? For me, yes. God can do anything.

F. Is Jesus Christ God on earth, which he never claimed, according to the Bible? I don't know... I'm still questioning that one. It doesn't quite make sense to me. God is the daddy. Jesus is the son. Father...child. Like the relationship God wants us to have with him. We are his children and he is our father and we must all get along and play nicely or there will be hell to pay.

G. Did he claim to be the son of God? I don't know about that one either. I wasn't there and I don't trust the messenger, the tampered Bible of today. I believe the spirit of God inspired this child and perhaps even a miraculous conception. For me, that is credible.

In closing, although I understand the Catholic trinity, I do not agree with it.

There is only one God and he is the Father of all faiths in God. In the Truth. The truth always comes to light.

Jesus Christ is my hero. He is my role model and I love him like the brother I never had. His spirit, the love of God, is ALWAYS there for me, helping me, and guiding me through God's love and the inspiration Jesus Christ gave through his exemplary human life. He stood up and said, "Wrong is wrong". No money and religion.... it's a bad mixture called politics. No worshipping things - materialism - worship GOD ALONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
THROUGH LOVE

When you love your kids do you neglect them or do you pay attention and try to teach them? For me, that's why God has kept sending HOLY MESSENGERS over time. People who were inspired with God's truth. Maybe the secret to everlasting peace is hidden amongst the varying faiths of the world; each faith holding a separate key, to the gates of heaven that have only one lock that all the keys fit.

Christianity - what a single human being can do when inspired from God? I believe Jesus performed miracles and healed people in the name of God. I've seen miracles. They are real. They happen.

This is my Christian faith. I do not know everything and I think about what I feel about things. I question what I do not understand.

Maybe in your culture, my perception of Jesus would qualify Jesus as a prohet? I think so. Correct me if I am wrong.

The mainstream many branched bedevilled institution known as Christianity will make you kiss an idol of Jesus while they steal your money through brainwashing. This is not the religion that the spirit of God has written upon our Christian hearts.

Jesus was all about reality, the truth, and the human potential for good; can people simply have faith in what is good, by definition: GOD? Can we stop focussing on the evil? Pay attention to the good stuff and be aware of the evil. That's where the focus of humanity should be. Towards GOD, being aware of a dwindling satanic hold. That's a good thought.

For you personally, what was the main mesage of Mohammed? In a nutshell please, for those without patience for endless quotation of scripture. :-)

Peace Brother

Mary XXX
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  #26  
Old 12-10-2004, 11:16 AM
Ahmad Ahmad is offline
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Default Re: The Truth shall set you free, if you only let it!

Peace Mary,

I would like to comment on two points:

1-you said: "The constant re-writing of the Bible, changing things here and there makes me question its authenticity as opposed to the Quran which is written in its original tongue, I believe, correct me if I'm wrong."

I believe the bible contains around 90% truth, the rest are the injected ideas of (Trinity, Savior, Lord is Jesus, Son of God, died for us all). These ideas were established long after Jesus departed (God raised his soul before they tortured the empty body) in the Nicene conference 325 AD.
As for Quran, it is letter by letter from God with no change whatsoever to it except two injected verses (exalting Muhammad) that were exposed and purified through the messenger of the covenant Rashad Khalifa by using the miracle of 19 (the mathematical phenomena that preserved the Quran for 1400 years), do you know about the superhuman code discovered in Quran? it proves the divine authorship of every letter of it. Thus Quran as the final testament confirms (the truths only) in the previous scriptures and supercedes them as God says.


2- Jesus in the bible is called consistently "son of man", in Quran he is called "Son of Mary". God is much more exalted than having a son, we should value our Creator as He should be valued, the Initiator of the seven Heavens and the earth!

[39:67] They can never fathom the greatness of GOD. The whole earth is within His fist on the Day of Resurrection. In fact, the universes are folded within His right hand. Be He glorified; He is much too high above needing any partners.

3- Jesus was just a righteous human messenger:

[4:171] O people of the scripture, do not transgress the limits of your religion, and do not say about GOD except the truth. The Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, was a messenger of GOD, and His word that He had sent to Mary, and a revelation from Him. Therefore, you shall believe in GOD and His messengers. You shall not say, "Trinity." You shall refrain from this for your own good. GOD is only one god. Be He glorified; He is much too glorious to have a son. To Him belongs everything in the heavens and everything on earth. GOD suffices as Lord and Master.

His birth is exactly as Adam's birth:

[3:59] The example of Jesus, as far as GOD is concerned, is the same as that of Adam; He created him from dust, then said to him, "Be," and he was.

His miracles are from God, not from him, Satan used them to dupe the people into idolizing a creature instead of devoting themselves to God alone. The holy spirit is none but Gabriel, the angel of revelation.

[5:110] GOD will say, "O Jesus, son of Mary, remember My blessings upon you and your mother. I supported you with the Holy Spirit, to enable you to speak to the people from the crib, as well as an adult. I taught you the scripture, wisdom, the Torah, and the Gospel. Recall that you created from clay the shape of a bird by My leave, then blew into it, and it became a live bird by My leave. You healed the blind and the leprous by My leave, and revived the dead by My leave. Recall that I protected you from the Children of Israel who wanted to hurt you, despite the profound miracles you had shown them. The disbelievers among them said, `This is obviously magic.'


4- There is God's path and there is Satan's paths, God's path is being free from obsessions, addictions, and unjustified hate and fear. God's path is fighting oppression, advocating righteousness and forbidding evil. God's path is to reverence Him alone, not your boss, not your spouse, not your prseident, nor Jesus or Muhammad or any priest, celebrity or saint. God's path is to be able to RELATE all the power (beauty, knowledge, skill...etc) of everything and everyone to God, which results in total devotion to Him alone, seeking His forgivness, and being appreciative of His blessings, lessons and provisions.

In short Muhammad's, Jesus's, Moses's and Abraham's message was to disbelieve first in all the false gods/centers (the visible things and people), acknowledge their 100% weakness and need for God, and then (becoming God-centered)by believing that God alone posseses all Power in the universe, thus nobody and nothing can harm or benefit on its own, nothing happens except in accordance with His will.
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  #27  
Old 12-10-2004, 11:42 AM
marypopinz marypopinz is offline
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Default Re: Dis-information.

True islam is indeed a beautiful religion. Thank you for explaining that to me.

I finally truly understand where you are speaking from and do you understand the relationship I have with Jesus Christ? He is the spirit of God that flows through humanity and was sent to bring peace to the nations he is the human embodiment of love and understanding.

Jesus is not God, he is of God. Just like you and me. The Christians are gonna bash me now! He was human and is now immortal, and so shall we be, following the truth and knowing the only God is good enough for our children, the Satanic crap has got to go.

It's all about one God and many divinely inspired human messengers

God Bless

Mary XXX
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  #28  
Old 12-10-2004, 11:53 AM
marypopinz marypopinz is offline
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Default Re: Dis-information.

Thank you Ahmad, understanding your faith has given me a better understanding of my own.

I do know that God calls all the shots and whatever happened in the past, happened... that's for sure. And whatever is gonna happen is gonna happen. That is for sure. The promise I believe from the Bible is an age of Peace. What is the hope of the Quran?

Mary XXX
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  #29  
Old 12-11-2004, 03:41 AM
Ahmad Ahmad is offline
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Default Proclaim, GOD IS ONE

Peace Mary,


Here is the hope of Quran, but note that it is only for those who believe in GOD ALONE. Jesus and Muhammad were ONLY human beings (nothing is devine about them), you can be better than Jesus and than Muhammad by breaking free from the illusion, that anybody or anything can help you.

Have no fear of the visible illusion, Satan's agents have already lost the battle, they are now trying to save their sinking ship!

The battle field is inside each one of us, if you defeat your Jinn companion, by taking charge of your mind and body and believing in God Alone, no power on earth can ever harm you.


Hope:

1- The children of Israel were saved from the tyrant (Pharaoh) and the tyrant and his troops were annihilated,

[7:137] We let the oppressed people inherit the land, east and west, and we blessed it. The blessed commands of your Lord were thus fulfilled for the Children of Israel, to reward them for their steadfastness, and we annihilated the works of Pharaoh and his people and everything they harvested.

[28:5] We willed to compensate those who were oppressed on earth, and to turn them into leaders, and make them the inheritors.

2- The earth shall be inherited very soon by the Submitters to God alone,

[21:105] We have decreed in the Psalms, as well as in other scriptures, that the earth shall be inherited by My righteous worshipers.

[21:106] This is a proclamation for people who are worshipers.

-------------------------------

How to be a winner?
God provides the answer through Noah:

[71:10] "I said, `Implore your Lord for forgiveness; He is Forgiving.

[71:11] " `He will then shower you generously with rain.

[71:12] " `And provide you with money and children, and orchards, and streams.' "

-------------------------------


Denounce the devil and his allies, get rid of all the satanic ideas of assigning powers to Jesus, he was no more than a human messenger who ate food and walked in the markets.

If you think he is the only hero, he is the spirit that dwells in the human beings...etc, then you haven't understood the message.

There is no god but God.

He is much exalted than anything we can imagine, none equals Him.



Sura - 112 Absoluteness (Al-Ikhlaas)
Order Of Revelation 22, Verses: 4

[112:0] In the name of God, Most Gracious, Most Merciful

[112:1] Proclaim, "He is the One and only GOD.

[112:2] "The Absolute GOD.

[112:3] "Never did He beget. Nor was He begotten.

[112:4] "None equals Him."
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  #30  
Old 12-11-2004, 06:47 AM
freeman freeman is offline
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Default Re: Proclaim, GOD IS ONE

Quote:
Denounce the devil and his allies, get rid of all the satanic ideas of assigning powers to Jesus, he was no more than a human messenger who ate food and walked in the markets.
You're a very persuasive man, Ahmad, and you might have even convinced me, if it weren't for my unpleasant association with the dark, demonic, spiritual forces of freemasonry.
Within the masonic lodge, ALL gods are worshipped with the exception of one: Jesus Christ. He is the only deity whose very name can get you expelled if you mention it at the wrong time.
Knowing what I know about my freemasonic friends, there is no doubt in my mind that the only god they wouldn't revere is the one most dangerous to them as children of Satan, the Prince of Darkness who masquerades as the Lord of Light.
Remember, Mary, simple deductive reaoning: When all other logical alternatives have been eliminated, that which remains is the solution.
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