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  #11  
Old 10-10-2006, 08:07 PM
redrat11 redrat11 is offline
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Default Re: Why The Wet Rag Christian Churches Have Failed Us So Miserably: Have They Woken Up?


Quote:
truebeliever wrote:
Could you give me some direct Bible quotes on these matters? Namely warnings regarding Astrology, dream work etc...

Ta.:-)

I think you'l find their are many "roundabout" warnings regarding using the "occult" for personal power while ignoring Faith in God but as for direct warnings I have found none.

In the end if I find Astrology, dreamwork, kinesiology etc...IMMENSELY useful in getting myself aligned correctly with the "Source".

The walls of the Church were put up for a reason I believe. It formed a foundation and protection from powerful forces. However...like any bird we must leave the nest sooner or later and if the Churches want people back their they must address the elephant in the living room.:-)
Interesting...


I'm digging through the Old Testament right now, Are you saying that if the Bible does'nt say anything on astrology being wicked, then it is OK?

As for direct warnings, well, what more do you want from GOD? A lightning bolt on the head! :-D
Just because GOD did'nt have humans write something down about a particular subject, does'nt mean it's ok. For example, human cloning, nowhere in the Bible does it say anything on that, yet, would you say it's ok for humans to partake in that endeavor, in other words being GOD-LIKE themselves?

If you find yourself needing a "outlet" to find more spiritual satisfaction, then that is your right, and that is your quest. As I've said, I tend to "absorb" both Testaments of the Bible, and then discern what GOD showed his followers, as to what is right and what is wrong, personally I feel that since GOD demanded that his ancient people not partake in "occultic activities" for their own benefit and safety, then ther'es no reason for me to either.

It really is a fascinating subect altogether, and I'm surely not the person to be teaching anybody anything, this is simply my "interpretation" of the Living Bible.

P.S. I can't find that button that looks like a chain you say. :-? by the way is cc experiencing problems?

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  #12  
Old 10-10-2006, 08:07 PM
redrat11 redrat11 is offline
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Default Re: Why The Wet Rag Christian Churches Have Failed Us So Miserably: Have They Woken Up?

Quote:
truebeliever wrote:
Could you give me some direct Bible quotes on these matters? Namely warnings regarding Astrology, dream work etc...

Ta.:-)

I think you'l find their are many "roundabout" warnings regarding using the "occult" for personal power while ignoring Faith in God but as for direct warnings I have found none.

In the end if I find Astrology, dreamwork, kinesiology etc...IMMENSELY useful in getting myself aligned correctly with the "Source".

The walls of the Church were put up for a reason I believe. It formed a foundation and protection from powerful forces. However...like any bird we must leave the nest sooner or later and if the Churches want people back their they must address the elephant in the living room.:-)
Interesting...


I'm digging through the Old Testament right now, Are you saying that if the Bible does'nt say anything on astrology being wicked, then it is OK?

As for direct warnings, well, what more do you want from GOD? A lightning bolt on the head! :-D
Just because GOD did'nt have humans write something down about a particular subject, does'nt mean it's ok. For example, human cloning, nowhere in the Bible does it say anything on that, yet, would you say it's ok for humans to partake in that endeavor, in other words being GOD-LIKE themselves?

If you find yourself needing a "outlet" to find more spiritual satisfaction, then that is your right, and that is your quest. As I've said, I tend to "absorb" both Testaments of the Bible, and then discern what GOD showed his followers, as to what is right and what is wrong, personally I feel that since GOD demanded that his ancient people not partake in "occultic activities" for their own benefit and safety, then ther'es no reason for me to either.

It really is a fascinating subect altogether, and I'm surely not the person to be teaching anybody anything, this is simply my "interpretation" of the Living Bible.

P.S. I can't find that button that looks like a chain you say. :-? by the way is cc experiencing problems?
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  #13  
Old 10-10-2006, 08:31 PM
truebeliever truebeliever is offline
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Default Re: Why The Wet Rag Christian Churches Have Failed Us So Miserably: Have They Woken Up?

Quote:
P.S. I can't find that button that looks like a chain you say. :-? by the way is cc experiencing problems?
You see the "Bold" button? Above it is a "Size" drop down menu. Straight above that and to the left is the "Link" button.:-)

As for problems...my posts wont go to the top of the front page. A few strange things happened when I posted a heap of stuff on the NWO moves "Down Under" and especially Israeli/Jewish machinations down here.

Who knows...nothing "they" do will ever scare me off the forums. In fact it is the ultimate compliment.:-)

Quote:
Just because GOD did'nt have humans write something down about a particular subject, does'nt mean it's ok. For example, human cloning, nowhere in the Bible does it say anything on that, yet, would you say it's ok for humans to partake in that endeavor, in other words being GOD-LIKE themselves?
Good point. But I cant put "Astrology" and "Human Cloning" in the same boat.

Astrology is a "tool" to know yourself and what gifts God has given you. It is NOT about predicting the future.

In the end I have my own "conscience". I have tried a disciplined appraoch to Christianity this year and found it made me quite depressed. I must "actualize" what God has given me. I have a strong desire to reform the Church and give people the tools to know God.

For some the classic Church is enough. For others more direct line to the Source is required. This must be done with the utmost reverence or demonic influence results and perhaps complete demonic possession ending in psychosis.

I have to follow my conscience whilst respecting the institutions that have been set up over 2000 years. I ask God for guidence every day...6 times a day.:-)

Quote:
It really is a fascinating subect altogether, and I'm surely not the person to be teaching anybody anything, this is simply my "interpretation" of the Living Bible.
You are right to question my motives and course. It can be very dangerous. However...someone has to do it. If the Churches had this stuff integrated into their traditions then we would'nt have Freemasonry and the other occultic secret societies sprouting endless threats to humanities existence.

I am open to a changing view. In fact my view changes all the time.:-)
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  #14  
Old 10-10-2006, 09:01 PM
redrat11 redrat11 is offline
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Default Re: Why The Wet Rag Christian Churches Have Failed Us So Miserably: Have They Woken Up?

Quote:
truebeliever wrote:


You see the "Bold" button? Above it is a "Size" drop down menu. Straight above that and to the left is the "Link" button.:-)









Astrology is a "tool" to know yourself and what gifts God has given you. It is NOT about predicting the future.



For some the classic Church is enough. For others more direct line to the Source is required. This must be done with the utmost reverence or demonic influence results and perhaps complete demonic possession ending in psychosis.





You are right to question my motives and course. It can be very dangerous. However...someone has to do it. If the Churches had this stuff integrated into their traditions then we would'nt have Freemasonry and the other occultic secret societies sprouting endless threats to humanities existence.

I am open to a changing view. In fact my view changes all the time.:-)

OOOOkkaaaay, Stupid me! I was searching my keyboard for that bold and link button you said, I just now realized it's on the screen page. :hammer: :-?

I'll say this, and provide you a link to some New AGE stuff TB. It has been my understanding of astrology to be a occult practice because I remember as a youngster when my Mom used to pay visits to a PALMREADER, It just seemed ODD even at those younger years. Now I grew up in a Catholic Environment, you know going to Catechism school and stuff, personally I enjoyed the NUNS slamming a 3ft wooden ruler on my knuckles everyday, :-? But seriously It was later in life that I grew into PROTESTANTISM Christianity that I came to understand what really are the dark forces of this world, and how Satan Decieves us. I have nothing against the Catholics, Most of them are good honest people like other denominations.

However, you have to admit, with all the info on OCCULT stuff out there, that astrology originated and evolved from OCCULT practices.

Anyway I hope you find what you seek in life.


here's some stuff, I'll avoid using those buttons you said for now,( i'm afraid I'll screw up this post)

Man should seek and accept spiritual instruction and direction directly from the spirit world.
The lure of the occult is almost always on the basis of acquiring knowledge or power. [Neil T. Anderson, The Bondage Breaker, pg. 114] We crave a knowledge that is esoteric, not normally available to the ordinary person. We want to experience a power that is spiritual and supernatural in origin. People don't seem to want to hear what God has to say, they want information and direction from someone else who "knows"; a psychic, a channeler, a palm-reader, a card-reader, Ouija boards, astrology, magic charming, automatic writing, or the spirit of a dead friend of relative. In a sense these are God-given desire, but they are intended to be fulfilled by the knowledge and power which comes from God. However, Satan is busy trying to pass off his counterfeits for God's knowledge and power as the real thing. If he can get us to accept his versions of knowledge and power, he has a foothold in our life


Check you out tommorrow TB.

http://www.jeremiahproject.com/prophecy/newage01.html
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  #15  
Old 10-11-2006, 06:07 AM
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Ozziecynic Ozziecynic is offline
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Default Re: Why The Wet Rag Christian Churches Have Failed Us So Miserably: Have They Woken Up?

TB: :-?
Quote:
and not sitting back like pathetic left leaning tamborine playing hippy's throwing flowers instead of the fire and brimstone needed to set straight the wrongs of this world.
YET!
Quote:
church clergy banging down doors of economic rationalists
TB just to clear up your confusion Economic Rationalists are rightwingers not Leftwingers!.

As for hippies your pro alt views of astrology kinsology look pretty hippie to me!.There are rightwing hippies you know are you one of them!. :-?
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  #16  
Old 10-11-2006, 09:44 AM
truebeliever truebeliever is offline
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Default Re: Why The Wet Rag Christian Churches Have Failed Us So Miserably: Have They Woken Up?

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TB just to clear up your confusion Economic Rationalists are rightwingers not Leftwingers!.
No, Economic Rationalists are the last true Marxists.

EVERYTHING revolves around Dialectical Materialism and Excel Spreadsheets. Just who opened up Oz to the "free market"? Just who DESTROYED our local industry?

Bob Hawke and Keating. A Rhodes Scholar and a lefty who collected French antique clocks and wore $1000 Armani suits.

I dont know what ANY of them are!

As for other matters...You have misread my post or I have not made myself clear...I want the clergy to BREAK DOWN the door of the economic rationalists and give them a kick in the nuts or at least flog them from the Temple.

You continually take me the wrong way. Just for clarity...i beleive in a true "free market"...for all but not on the international scale.

I do not believe you make people dependant on the State, break down family and societal structures and THEN rip the rug from peoples feet leaving them tossing in the wind.
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  #17  
Old 10-13-2006, 07:05 PM
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Ozziecynic Ozziecynic is offline
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Default Re: Why The Wet Rag Christian Churches Have Failed Us So Miserably: Have They Woken Up?

:roll: :-?
Quote:
No, Economic Rationalists are the last true Marxists.

EVERYTHING revolves around Dialectical Materialism and Excel Spreadsheets. Just who opened up Oz to the "free market"? Just who DESTROYED our local industry?
That would be the first time i have heard them described as such!.Its not really a surprise such an absurd claim comes from you and the amount of absurd claims you make is habitual!.
However your just cc professor or yoda in your own lunch box nowhere else little more reading or even offical education may do you some favours in understanding offical ideology not some ignorant redneck improvisation!.


Quote:
Bob Hawke and Keating. A Rhodes Scholar and a lefty who collected French antique clocks and wore $1000 Armani suits.
I am NOT discussing Keating or Hawke I am talking about the Liberal Party and John Howard.
The point is you claimed Howard was not an economic rationalist which is clearly false!
There is no evidence you can use to disprove this obvious fact if there is i would like to see it.Your natural petty rightwing bias blinds you to the real pushers of globalism!.
Bascially i see the present ALP in Australia simply as pissing in the pockets of the Liberal party it is no secret to most indignous poorer anglo celtics the fabians are in bed with globalism however that is not the point of my post John Howard and his liberals are!.
Some of the Liberals biggest voters are the neuvo rich asians and other upwardly mobile ethnic groups in sydney as if, they give dam about the plight of farmers or poorer white aussies in rural or regional areas.


Quote:
I want the clergy to BREAK DOWN the door of the economic rationalists and give them a kick in the nuts or at least flog them from the Temple.
Well the Liberal party are certainly not going to break it down for you not even Family First or the CDP.
Face facts the rightwing no longer represents christian morality no political party could do the Bible any justice. Mankind is really interested in mankind not God thats why i dont believe in theocracy!.You put too much faith in human nature and not God by the look of it!.

Quote:
You continually take me the wrong way. Just for clarity...i beleive in a true "free market"...for all but not on the international scale.
No i simply dont agree with you, there is a difference and I feel it is my place to correct you or guide your indignation if i can in the right direction!.
You cant have free trade on small scale without having it large scale! We are global economy not a commune or insular state like cuba or Iran we part of the global economy capitalism couldnt operate on nationalised or socialised model in this day age that is the fact One Nation couldnt come to terms with.

Quote:
I do not believe you make people dependant on the State, break down family and societal structures and THEN rip the rug from peoples feet leaving them tossing in the wind.
People are dependent of the state right now ad that is under a liberal gov.
The facts are we live Corporatist system where governement and business big and small cooperate for the same goals there is no antagonism between the two!.I am not sure what your are struggling against TB you seem confused in many areas! :-?
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  #18  
Old 10-13-2006, 08:12 PM
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Default Re: Why The Wet Rag Christian Churches Have Failed Us So Miserably: Have They Woken Up?

Although late in commenting to this post I do find this an interresting subject, I find that for myself those who are sheltered in their cities that have to many lights that they obscure the star filled night don't really see the grandeur of God, on the other hand, those who are in areas that have great star filled skies frequently have a better respect and outword relation to others, and also arnt such holy rollers that want to control others peoples thoughts.
A good church is not founded by stone block, just as its not a certainty that it is a wise church by how many people frequent there.
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  #19  
Old 10-13-2006, 09:50 PM
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Default Re: Why The Wet Rag Christian Churches Have Failed Us So Miserably: Have They Woken Up?

Although I thought that I had wrote this, A good church is not founded by stone block, just as its not a certainty that it is a wise church by how many people frequent there.
Am I taking this from scripture in any way?
also does this sound familiar, a full church is not an indication of its worth.
just not sure if I'm plagerizing or not.
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Old 10-14-2006, 05:07 AM
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Default Re: Why The Wet Rag Christian Churches Have Failed Us So Miserably: Have They Woken Up?

I understand where you're all coming from. I just want to set the record straight by first defining what 'astrology' truly is... as well as what you TB specifically do with it.

as·trol·o·gy Pronunciation (-strl-j)
n.
1. The study of the positions and aspects of celestial bodies in the belief that they have an influence on the course of natural earthly occurrences and human affairs.
2. Obsolete Astronomy.



Astrology is a group of systems, traditions, and beliefs in which knowledge of the relative positions of celestial bodies and related information is held to be useful in understanding, interpreting, and organizing knowledge about personality, human affairs, and other terrestrial events. A practitioner of astrology is called an astrologer, or, less often, an astrologist. Historically, the term mathematicus was used to denote a person proficient in astrology, astronomy, and mathematics.

Although the two fields share a common origin, modern astronomy is entirely distinct from astrology. While astronomy is the scientific study of astronomical objects and phenomena, the practice of astrology is concerned with the correlation of heavenly bodies (and measurements of the celestial sphere) with earthly and human affairs. Astrology is variously considered by its proponents to be a symbolic language, a form of art, science, or divination. Critics, including the scientific community, generally consider astrology to be a pseudoscience or superstition as it has failed empirical tests in controlled studies.

Most astrological traditions are based on the relative positions and movements of various real or construed celestial bodies and on the construction of celestial patterns as seen at the time and place of the event being studied. These are chiefly the Sun, Moon, the planets, the stars and the lunar nodes. The calculations performed in casting a horoscope involve arithmetic and simple geometry which serve to locate the apparent position of heavenly bodies on desired dates and times based on astronomical tables. The frame of reference for such apparent positions is defined by the tropical or sidereal zodiacal signs on one hand, and by the local horizon (ascendant) and midheaven (medium coeli) on the other. This latter (local) frame is typically further divided into the twelve astrological houses.

The origins of much of astrology that would later develop in Asia, Europe, and the Middle East are found among the ancient Babylonians and their system of celestial omens that began to be compiled around the middle of the 2nd millennium BCE. This system of celestial omens later spread either directly or indirectly through the Babylonians to other areas such as India, China, and Greece where it merged with pre-existing indigenous forms of astrology. This Babylonian astrology came to Greece initially as early as the middle of the 4th century BCE, and then around the late 2nd or early 1st century BCE after the Alexandrian conquests, this Babylonian astrology was mixed with the Egyptian tradition of Decanic astrology to create horoscopic astrology. This new form of astrology, which appears to have originated in Alexandrian Egypt, quickly spread across the ancient world into Europe, the Middle East and India.



Consider also the related topics;

* Age of Aquarius
* Ascending planet
* Astrological age
* Astrological associations
* Astrological degrees
* Astrological symbol
* Astrology and astronomy
* Astrology and computers
* Astrology and numerology
* Domicile
* House (astrology)
* Katarche
* List of magical terms and traditions

* Lunation
* The Mars effect
* Medical astrology
* New age
* Nadi astrology
* Occult
* Ophiuchus (arbitrary star constellation)
* Planets in astrology
* Proposed theories of astrology
* Rose Cross and Astrology
* Sidereal astrology
* Tropical year

Wikipedia

Some who replied had it right. Astrology is a tool for divination of the cosmos in an attempt to gain insight on things to come. It is used to predict the future. If you want, I'll locate relevant quotes from Christ that make it clear that we are not to foretell the future, for it is in the hands of God alone and through faith, we require not these distractions. You will find additonal evidence in your work in astrology when it kind of NEVER leads to Christ. He will never be mentioned.
Astrology is not prayer. Astrology puts you in touch with you... though there is no basis to validate astrology in any way whatsoever. Sorry to disappoint you, but for example, the US has more astrological symbolism embedded into it than any other nation and it's run prominently by Freemasons. Consider the great pyramids and their astological aligment. The pyramids still stand today to remind us that God will come to us and not the other way around. Let me know if you want additional references or clarification.

I think you are a good person TB and you mean well.
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